MonarchyDilemma:JakrapobResigns!

[GWR]

Originally Posted by GWR

See also Previous (Copied) Post in this thread that identifies some of the sites that are likely to be affected.
Related thread on a long cited conspiracy theory that certain Thai politicians are plotting to overthrow the monarchy:
http://www.angkor.com/2bangkok/2bang...newpost&t=1679
Link may expire:
http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_....php?id=127737
http://www.nationmultimedia.com/brea...ewsid=30073488
http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2008...s_30073490.php

This seems to be a partial list of websites that the government might try to block. Some seem to have already decided to throw in the towel themselves:

http://www.youtube.com/StopleseMajeste
www.2519me.com
http://hello-siam.blogspot.com
http://rukchard.blogspot.com
http://www.midnightuniv.org
http://www.serichon.com
http://www.prachatai.com/05/th/home

http://www.sapaprachachon.blogspot.com

http://s125.photobucket.com/albums/p73/nicolejung99/?

http://www.weloveudon.net
http://www.tlt-global.com/web

http://www.secondclass111.com/index.php?

http://thai-journalist-democratic-front.com
http://www.sameskybooks.org
http://www.newskythailand.com
http://www.chupong.net

http://www.sapaprachachon.blogspot.com

http://www.pcc-thai.com/web2
http://www.datopido.newsit.es

http://thai-journalist-democratic-front.com

http://www.Sapaprachachon.org/index.thml

http://www.mvnews.net/home.php
http://www.cptradio.com
http://www.thaipeoplevoice.org/

http://www.nationsiam.com/frontpage/Itemid,1

http://www.arayachon.org/
http://www.siamreview.net
http://www.warotah.blogspot.com
http://www.killerpress.wordpress.com
http://www.gunner2007.wordpress.com

[GWR]

An article on one of the possibly soon to be blocked sites, with a sideways comment on Jakrapob and his detractors:


[Photo: Bangkok Post - A sign attacking the state-owned Transport Co outside the Transport Ministry declares "Tiger sleep eat" - a Thai adage similar to ``free-riding fat cat''. Bus concessionaires say the company is not doing anything to help them offset rising fuel costs.]

I say tomato and you say foreign eggplant
Harrison George
23 May 2008
Alien Thoughts
Yesterday morning’s Bangkok Post had an interesting caption to a photograph. The picture is of a protestor outside the offices of the Land Transportation Department and his sign concerns the rise in fuel prices, which the government only sort of controls, and the implication for bus fares, which the government does control quite strictly.

The protest is of itself rather predictable. The sign is not. It is in wo scripts, Thai and English. The Bangkok Post caption writer thought it was necessary to explain only the bit that was written in English. Perhaps it was assumed even non-Thai readers could guess what the Thai says. But ‘Tiger Eat Sleep’ was thought to be beyond the comprehension of the readers of the Bangkok Post.

Notice that I said the sign was in two ‘scripts’, not ‘languages’. Most people would not recognize ‘Tiger Eat Sleep’ as part of the English language any more than Chomsky’s famous ‘Colourless green ideas sleep furiously’, a deliberately meaningless linguistic invention concocted to define what is and is not English.

But maybe I am wrong. I am beginning to suspect that, apart from English and Thai, there is a subversive hybrid third alternative out there, a language that uses words that seem to be English, but which is incomprehensible to English speakers. It can be understood only by Thais who have been through any form of the ever-changing English language curriculum taught in the Thai education system.

My first inkling that there was a third language came when I decided to learn to read Thai by doing translations. I’d got the basic grammar and cracked the Thai alphabet, and in doing so discovered the almost perfect logic behind the order of Thai letters (even more logical that the near symmetry of English alphabetical order). So I could use a dictionary. Translation just meant a lot of patient page-flipping.

It maybe took me half a day to do a paragraph, with a large portion of that spent in a futile search for words in the dictionary that turned out not to be words but names (no luxury of an upper case in Thai). But at the end of that half day, I had learned quite bit and been paid for doing so. Much more economical that me paying a teacher.

But then came the day when I was given an article to translate that already contained some English words. I thought this would make it easier. It drove me nuts. Every time I thought I’d understood what he as driving at, an English language word would come along that just didn’t fit. So I kept going back to check if there was another way of understanding the Thai. I was trying to weave some kind of narrative path in the Thai that would connect these otherwise unrelated outcrops of English vocabulary, and I was not succeeding.

And every time I went in desperation to a Thai speaker to ask what the Thai meant, they just confirmed my first assumptions. Eventually someone clued me in. I’d understood the Thai correctly. What I hadn’t understood was the English words.

I was trying to understand them with a meaning you might find in a dictionary. But the writer hadn’t used them with that meaning. Somehow, they had acquired a special meaning, one found only when the word was embedded inside a Thai text and one that a normal native speaker of English couldn’t expect to know.

By this time I was just glad to get done with the frustration and ignored the English words, substituting them with something that seemed to make better sense. I then waited for a protest from the original author. Why had I removed the words that were already in English and started translating English into English?

The protest never came and eventually I had chance to talk to the author. It turned out that his understanding of these English words was highly idiosyncratic and rather different from the dictionary definitions. But he didn’t know that. He had in his mind concept X and believed that the English word Y conveyed that concept. The fact that the rest of the English-speaking world thought that Y meant Z, not X, didn’t seem to trouble him. And this ability to invent novel meanings for words hasn’t held him back. He went on to work for the Word Bank.

Over the years I became convinced that this third almost-but-not-quite-English is the product of the way English is taught in Thailand. For example, this system, which lord only knows fails on many fronts, has been eminently successful in teaching Thais the non-existent English word ‘nowsaday’.

This is in fact bound to happen in a system where teachers themselves are asked to teach what they don’t know, where social and intellectual control over students is much more highly valued than actually learning anything, and where examinations are a major tool in the system of control.

Almost every farang in the land has at some point been asked to help with the neighbour’s child’s English homework. This homework is almost always in the form of a test (which itself tells you something) but the embarrassing thing for the native speaker is that you can’t figure out the answer. The latest one to floor me was a simple spelling test. You were supposed to identify the correctly spelled word among 4 choices, two of which were ‘dinner’ and ‘diner’.

You know what’s probably happened. The teacher has taught the word ‘dinner’ and in a misguided search for something to set for homework has decided that knowing how to spell words in isolation is somehow an indicator of language competence. And maybe ignorance or thoughtlessness has included a second, but perfectly spelled word into the list.

So what you have to do in these situations is tell next door’s munchkin ‘This is what your teacher thinks is the right answer, but in real English, both these are right.’ Perhaps that way the schoolchild will successfully achieve mastery of this artificial construct that Thai schools teach and which is called in the syllabus ‘English’, but really isn’t.

It could become a valuable skill in later life. For example, there seems to be a pressing need right now for people who can misunderstand innocuous English speeches at the FCCT and translate them into something Thai that can be judged to be lèse majesté.

http://www.prachatai.com/english/news.php?id=650

[GWR]

Jakrapob looks to television for help
By The Nation
Published on May 24, 2008

PM's Office Minister Jakrapob Penkair has agreed to an adviser's suggestion that television documentaries be produced in honour of royal family members to counter allegations that he acted in contempt of the monarchy.

Jakrapob gave the green light to the written recommendation from adviser On-anong Premasakul that documentaries be produced for the state-run NBT to broadcast ahead of the birthdays of HRH Crown Prince Maha Vajiralongkorn on July 28 and Her Majesty the Queen on August 12, according to a copy of the document shown on the Matichon Online website.

The document contained the adviser's memo dated May 14 and Jakrapob's hand-written approval of her proposal. He instructed On-anong to coordinate with the Public Relations Department director-general about the production and broadcast.

Meanwhile, Somchai Wongsawat, deputy prime minister and education minister, yesterday said he was unaware of the arrangement, adding that he did not think the pressure on Jakrapob would affect the government's performance. He said Jakrapob was doing his best to prove his innocence. However, if Jakrapob really did as alleged, he should admit to it, Somchai said.

Critics and the opposition have accused Jakrapob of acting in contempt of the monarchy when giving a speech last year about the patronage system in Thai politics.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2008...s_30073854.php

Will you be watching?

[Wisarut]

Now, Farmers Revolting AGIANST Ai Maew and PPP for lettting Arab invrestors to farm on the back of the farmers.

http://www.thaipost.net/index.asp?bk...963&cat_id=501

Ai Phongthep rapping AGAIJNST Chart Thai to clear that they are NOT selling out the Naitonal as accused by Democrat and Chart Thai
http://thaiinsider.info/portal/content/view/8461/12/

Weekly Commnetary by Ekkayut and the Gang: Farming on the backs
Even AI Maew is no longer want to take care of Ee Phen by Ai Samak is goign to take of Ee Phen to please UDD men ... creatign the wedge between UDD and Ai Maew's Inner circle.

Now, Army has sent a warning to Ai Samak that he hasto ged rid of Ee Phen as soon as possible. ... It is up to the translation of Ee Phen speech by Ee Phen which will give the final vindict ...

The powerful one also sent a warnign to Ai Maew and Co. that if there is a chance to escape the Royal Wrath, please do so or the Royal Wrath would wipe out AI Maew and CO. out of the SUrface of Earth.

If AI Maew was still lulled by the black magic of Khmer Wizards and the plea from the Red Doctors (alogn with those left wing NGOs), the Royal Wrath ensues.

For the case of 25 May Demonstration -> Sonthi Limthognkul is askign to come as many as posssible of Thai People would have to give away the constitution Monarchy to the New Republican Regime

Weel, Army Top Brasses siad, just the case of Ee Phen ALONE would be the legitimated reason for the new coup. However, they want to ensure that they get the right men for the New PM -> Ananda Panyarachun, Asa Sarasin, or Mom Aui (Priyathorn Devakul)

For the case of Ai Maew, when he brought Saudi Sheiks to see the Farmver vcillage the Fatso Praphat Phothasuthon and ask for investment of rice plntation, Khun SOmsak (Hia Tue) and Banharn have thrown bombshells
to AI Maew that This the act of Traitors who allow Foringers to farm on the back of Thai Farmers!

Well, it is just the act of AI Mews to be in Politcial Limelight, the exampkle for Generation Y to follow by decaing His Majesy's images or so.

Atrthe Four Season Hotel in Wireless Road, AI maew has made a Party for PPP men alogn with other coalitions and Arab Shieks ... with those Sidelien gals of Ratchada Ring, RCA, and Patpong .... with the irrisistable prices ... 5000 - 10000 Baht a night in moonlight!

Howver, the powerful one giving a grin to Ai Maew that ...

So long you keep your mouth shut, you'll be Okay or you will confront with Royal Wrath so soon ...

http://thaiinsider.info/portal/content/view/8454/23/

[GWR]

The price of speech in Thailand
By Frank G. Anderson
Column: Thai Traditions
Published: May 23, 2008
Nakhonratchasima, Thailand — Thailand’s social, academic and political leadership seems to agree that the country has political woes, but in fact political woes are not the problem, only a symptom. The cause is a corrupt society.

There is also a corresponding lack of public responsibility on the part of the individual Thai, making positive reform more challenging and difficult. Finally, the nail in the coffin is a strict adherence to the belief that Thais must remain monolithic, “non-divisive,” committed to the monarchy and forever permitting elected politicians to do what they seem to do best -- personally benefit from corruption.

It’s not a pretty picture by any means. Incidental foreign visitors to the Land of Smiles and even, perhaps, the majority of expatriates within the kingdom, may not express blanket agreement with such a negative assessment. But what is the reason for their reluctance?

It is very possible that in adapting to their new home by adopting the cultural mores, foreigners have learned to submit to the collective will of the apathetic public and adopt a distorted version of the philosophy of the Noble Truths in the unique way that most Thais have adapted as they are brought up in their own society. In short, these foreigners may have “gone native” and thus can no longer differentiate what they once knew as the difference between right and wrong.

It sounds condescending, of course. But for those in Thailand who have long been privy to hundreds of private conversations, public heated discussions, leaked intelligence and unspoken yet accepted social practices -- generally through language proficiency -- for those who have learned to “think like a Thai” and forget general cultural references, the ability to use peripheral vision in thought, speech and action is diminished.

An example one often experiences among professional Thai translators is their reluctance to translate material from English to Thai or Thai to English that places Thailand, Thai culture or Thai society in a harshly critical light. One foreign Thai-fluent writer, for example, was contacted by a Thai living in San Francisco over a year ago to help translate sensitive language into English for a book about Thai culture and the monarchy. Some of the material hinted at criticism of the monarchy, or more accurately, highlighted situations that Thais steer away from because they somehow involve the monarchy or have been shown in the past to be deemed to be on sensitive ground. The Thai that sent the material to the foreigner in Thailand to translate told the foreigner that no Thai in the San Francisco area was willing to do the job.

Compare this to several instances here in Thailand where a foreigner needed to have translations of English language editorials into Thai. Most of these editorials did not involve the monarchy, but were critical accounts of Thai society and/or social practices he felt were out of touch with the values of Buddhism and democracy. When Thai translators were asked to convert these essays into Thai, they quickly refused.

In one case, the translator falsely let the foreigner believe he would do the work but a week later, when it should have been ready, the translator said he could no longer accept that or any other translation work.

The reluctance to even speak about material critical of Thai society, not just originate it, also occurs on the foreigner side. While working on a book about Thailand, another foreigner asked a long-time colleague from England to write a foreword on the author’s behalf. Having written at least two books himself about Thailand, the colleague emailed back quickly that he felt he was the wrong person to do the job. The overtone, however, was that the material in the book was critical of Thailand and that he would rather not become involved with it.

Needless to say, his own books were polite tourism surveys and lent nothing to important commentary on Thai society.

In an online interview, “The King Never Smiles” author Paul Handley commented, when the interviewer asked him why he had written such a book that was seen by many -- especially the Thai government -- to be critical of the Thai monarchy, Handley replied, “The question to ask is why such a book was not written before.”

Handley hit the nail on the head in a sense. Given ingrained and inculcated reluctance by the individual Thai to criticize anything -- although this is often not the actual situation -- important books that really detail Thai social character and Thai society in depth, up to and including the monarchy, are automatically discouraged. Somehow, it’s just not kosher. So Thais comply and foreigners who decide they need to keep a low profile go along with the flow. Important reportage, in-depth coverage of personalities and events, especially of social upheaval and a meaningful prognosis for Thailand’s future, are all rendered meaningless because they are never written.

Any serious foreigner writing about Thai social developments -- whether they are political, reflect on the monarchy or the country’s wayward practices of Buddhism -- are usually nipped in the bud before they start. There are too many conflicting vested interests afloat to generate truly serious commentary about the Land of Smiles. After all, if you keep your mouth shut, go into business with a local Thai who has had the government “lock the specs” on a product with a guaranteed market that only you are allowed to import into Thailand, and you bought a nice condo on the beach and have a really beautiful Thai wife or girlfriend, are making lots of money, and have friends and relative immunity from the police, then why rock the boat?

Author Paul Findley went ahead anyhow and rocked the boat. He does not expect to be welcomed back into Thailand anytime in the near future. But his book, “The King Never Smiles,” tells an important story and not only about certain aspects of the country’s revered monarchy. It is about Thai society in a more general way, a meaningful way. But in the land of illusion, this kind of revelation is viewed by the elite as divisive and unwanted, and they will always fight to preserve the status quo.

Yet, even as this column is being written, the People’s Alliance for Democracy will gather at Bangkok’s Victory Monument this Sunday, May 25, to protest government mandated changes to last year’s Constitution. Also, on Monday the Thai government spokesman and minister assigned to the Prime Minister’s Office, Jakrapob Phenkair, is scheduled to hold a press conference where he will try to explain his own acts of lese majeste while in Los Angeles on Nov. 10, 2007, as well as at a Foreign Correspondents Club of Thailand seminar. Despite the illusions of social unity and joint purpose, despite the cultural pressures that impose silence on those who would speak, there are still those who will speak, Thai or foreigner.

http://www.upiasiaonline.com/Society...thailand/1363/
http://www.thekoratpost.com

[Wisarut]

Originally Posted by GWR

http://www.upiasiaonline.com/Society...thailand/1363/
http://www.thekoratpost.com

In such a case, I CONDMEN Farang who write such an article as the one who advocate "Ill-Liberal" Democrary whcih is a "fake" democracy ...

BTW, Ai samak is tryign to defence Ee Pheng and Ai maew for the caseo allowign Arabian investors to farm on the backs of farmers.

http://thaiinsider.info/portal/content/view/8467/12/

PAD is fighting
http://thaiinsider.info/portal/content/view/8471/12/

Suraphongse Chainarm (Thai deplomats - a grandchildren of Direk Chainarm)
is askign Thai people not to allow the whitewash of PPP by consitution amendament.

http://www.manager.co.th/Politics/Vi...=9510000060673

The gangs who destroy Thao Mahaphrom and Phanom RUng are the same one.
http://www.manager.co.th/Politics/Vi...=9510000060631

Dr. Prayoon is watchign the Translation fo Ee Phen's speech by Ee Phen
http://www.manager.co.th/Politics/Vi...=9510000060697

Dr. Raphee Sakrit askign Somsak to defence Thai Farmers froim beign farmed on their back.
http://www.manager.co.th/Politics/Vi...=9510000060700

Dr. Raphee Sakrit warning PAD to beware the 5th column (UDD & PPP men) who come to help PAD.

http://www.manager.co.th/Politics/Vi...=9510000060469

The Royalists are askign Samak to Boycott Ee Phen or he'll be Boycotted.
http://www.manager.co.th/Politics/Vi...=9510000060687

[GWR]

FCCT SPEECH
Watch Jakrapob's controversial speech
By The Nation

The Nation Online provides a video clip of what PM's Office Minister Jakrapob Penkair said at the Foreign Correspondents' Club of Thailand last year.

The full transcript of the speech is available at Government House website.
[Mod:http://www.thaigov.go.th/index.aspx I haven't yet found the exact link.]

The long clip is divided into three parts to facilitate downloading time.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2008...s_30074013.php

Jakrapob counter-attacks, says he was set up
By Anucha Charoenpo and Manop Thip-Osod

PM's Office Minister Jakrapob Penkair announced on Monday he was taking seven days leave and immediately accused Abhisit Vejjajiva and his Democrat party of intentionally mistranslating his controversial speech on patronage with the purpose of forcing him from office.

The embattled minister, facing accusations he criticised the royal institution in his August 2007 remarks at the Foreign Correspondents' Club of Thailand, challenged Mr Abhisit to a public debate.

"My Abhisit should tell the public which part of my speech he considers to be lese majeste. I'm ready to go to any forum with him. Just tell me when," he said during a one-hour press conference, where he distributed four versions of the Thai translation of his speech on the topic "Democracy and the Patronage System of Thailand."

According to Mr Jakrapob, the controversial sentences in the speech, which he says were translated differently into Thai, are: "We are led into believing that the best form of government is guided democracy or democracy with His Majesty's gracious guidance. It has a continual development of ideas and beliefs into the current situation in which I see as a clash or the clash between democracy and patronage system."

Another is: "And this political situation will not end like the May incident in 1992. There is no one to end it because everyone is involved," Mr Jakrapob said.

He delivered his speech when the country was ruled by a government picked by the military after the September 2006 coup.

The country was then divided into the pro- and anti-Thaksin camps.

Mr Thaksin, who is admired by Mr Jakrapob, later supported the People Power party which won the general election last December.

Mr Jakrapob claimed the translation by the Democrats was aimed at causing him damage and threatened legal action against Mr Abhisit if he fails to name the translator.

He termed the opposition's actions old-style political tactics used against "a new generation of politicians".

Democrat executive Sirichoke Sopha said later that he was the translator and would take responsibility. He had nothing to hide.

Mr Jakrapob insisted he was loyal to the royal family and was a political victim of the opposition.

"Time will eventually show who is more loyal to the monarchy, me or Abhisit," he said.

There was no reason for him to resign because he had done nothing wrong. He would spend his leave gathering more information and reviewing public and media responses to his press conference before making any further decision.

Mr Jakrapob made clear that he would accept the "harshest punishment" if he is found guilty. "If the law proves that I am really guilty, I deserve the harshest punishment," he said.

He referred to the police complaint laid against him by Pol Maj Wattanasak Mungkitjakarndee.

Two weeks ago Mr Abhisit submitted the Democrat version of the translation to Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej, pushing for the PM's Office minister to be removed from the cabinet.

Mr Jakrapob said the Thai translations by Pol Maj Wattanasak and the Democrats contained misleading terms and incorrect meanings.

Mr Abhisit refused to react to the attack by the minister.

But Mr Sirichoke accused Mr Jakrapob of trying to confuse the public by failing to specifically point to the sentences which were translated differently and caused him damage.

Link may expire:
http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_....php?id=127848