BangSue/Phahonyothin/MoChit

[pong]

some time ago I read/heard that the Southern main line trains (as first, later to be followed up by all expresses) would now only start from bang Sue Junction station, and not anymore from main HuaLamPong. The relevant platform at BangSue was all renovated and got a canopy last year. This should happen when the new subway opens, to relieve traffic jam congestion (which is indeed enormous in the morning peak at Yommarat etc.)
As I currently am not in thailand, I just wonder: does anyone of you know if the SRT will and if yes, when, going to dot his?

[Wisarut]

Yeah, After the Northern and the Noreastern Train, the Southern Express Train will follow soon ... ONLY Commuters are allow to reach Hua Lamphong ... even though many poor fololks from Isan has Lamented that they ONLY know how to go around BKK after reaching Hua Lamphong but NOT in the case of Bangsue.
Gate 2 of Subway is right at the Southern Railway Platform ... so
Southern express will follow soon.

[The Enforcer!]

To test my understanding -

North/North-Eastern - mainline trains terminate at Bangsue; Commuter Line (from Rangsit?) pass onto Hua Lampong.

Southern - mainline train will SOON terminate at Bangsue.

The Enforcer!

[The Enforcer!]

So do non-commutter trains (i.e. those from Chiang Mai etc) stop at stations after Lopburi or only major stations like Ayuthaya, Rangsit and Bangsue?

And all North/NE terminate at Bangsue?

The Enforcer!

[Wisarut]

Fro the the lines staring from the stationd to the other stations outside BKK and vincinities area, they will be designated as "Local train" ....

However, those rapid and express will stop ONLy at major stations.

[pong]

yes, more or less, check current timetable of SRT. also: a NEW platform (wopuld be too grand to call it station) was opened last year just beside the Mochit2 big busstation, from where [last year) 3 (three) regular stopping trains left, plus a higher nr of relief trains in busy times [like songkran, new year etc.]
this station is NOT at all adjacent to bangSue, but rather at the far/other side of the container/freight yard, and needs a lengthy bustrip on nr 52 to reach!
However: My real question was, IF this program has started from now on: but on the other hand SRT is known to implement these changes without any due notice.

[bangyuk]

Am I going crazy? Surely SRT did this in 1990 - opened a new platform at Bang Sue and forced Southern Line trains to terminate there. Some dumb ideas never seem to go away!

Ian

[Wisarut]

Khun Pong,

That's Phaholyothin Station - the terminal station of several train. It is a temporary measure before Subway to Bangsue is opened. However the station name sign in northern section is dilapidated (broken) while the southern sign look just slightly better,

Actually Southern railway platform has been introduced since 1990's... Now, the platform has been refurbished after the Subway has reached Bang Sue.

Actually this kind to new termianl at Bangsue has proped up since 1938 .... and the cheap land purchasing for Bangsue railya has started since 1941 ..... During the time of Field Marshal Sarit, they even plan to terminalte the service from Hua Lamphogn to Bangsure to make room for more cars ... but the plan has been shelf in 1964.

SRT even plan to have a bypass line from Bangsue to Klongtan (now ratchadaphisek Inner Ring Road since 1971) ... However, Subway has now funcrton as the way to conect the Norhtern and Eastern line .... but only After Airport Link has become a reality since Makkasan has to be moved so as to make a convenient conection with Phetburi station. Furthermore SRT workers have to moved to eastern Suburbs like Lad Krabang - Hua Takhe or so along Eastern railway so as to make the room for Makkasan land development.

The series of those changes and upheavels REALLY PISS those SRT railwaymen A LOT!

[The Enforcer!]

Dear Kh. Wisarut,

Do you have a station layout plan for Bangsue?

The Enforcer!

[Wisarut]

Latest news: Bangsue to Bang Bumru via Rama 6 Bridge is going to be opend on October 9, 2004.

Well, for the Northern section, we call "hor Kunjae Chitlladda"
(the Switching tower of Chitladda), near Chitladda Royal Station.

On the otehr hand, the Southern section switching is near Yommaraj Stop - so you know the name, don't you?

Nope ... no map of Suvannabhum Airport Link in English yet ... even though you can see the name in Thai though ...

You are refering to those BCF .... the flat wagon for container, don't oyu?

[Wisarut]

So far, the Double trackign of SOuthern Line has come up with the following results:

1) Signals have been installed from Talingchan to Nakhon Pathom

2) The track from Bangsue - Talingchan - Ban Chimplee (18 km)
is under rehabilitation (to be DONE in 2005) even though the double track is stretchign form Bangsue to Nakhon Pathom
due to both poor double track handling by the contractors.

3) Now, The double track section from Bangsue to Bang Bumru
is OPENED for ONLY cargo train with sped limit of 30 kph since
the new signal and communication system has NOT been
installed in this section yet.

[Wisarut]

Now, SRT just finish Installing the signal since Dec 29, 2004, SRT is going to test the signal system on the double track (Bangsue - Bang Bumru) on Jan 12, 2005. The traffic arrangement will be as follows:

1) Inbound (Bang Bumru - Bang Sue) -> Use the old track
2) Outbound (Bangsue - Bang Bumru) -> Use the New Track

The speed limit ofr thsi section is 50 kph

After reaching Bang Bumru, the traffic will be SWITCHED
so that the outbound track (Bang Bumrui - Talingchan) wil use
the old track while the inboudn track (Talingchan - Bang Bumru) will use the new track.

Initially, they have limited the speed of double track to 20 kphg - ONLY for cargo train to Phaholyothin Cargo depot since the switchers have not be unlocked to allow Switching ....

[Wisarut]

Thai Railfan said:

I rod Trang Express 83 from Bangsue 2 to Bang Bumru. Initially, it will go alogn the main track fo the Northern line at bangsue Shed and then turn lefdt to the new double track at the lathe shop. The crackign sound between the wheels and the track is HORRENDOUSLY Noisy due to the friction between the rusting
track and the steel wheels even though the riding is REALLY SMOOTH.

After reaching Bang Bumru, Trang Express has turned into the the good old main track.

The Inbound section of Rama 6 Bridge has speed limit to 50 KPH
(the minimum speed to the main track) ... However, the speed limit on the ramp to go up to Rama 6 bridge is 40 KPH

[Yappofloyd]

Wasn't sure if I should put this on the railway site but it is more Urban Issues and not many threads here....

Being alerted by 2BKK.com today to the the new OTP site, http://www.ntbr.org/, on the airport link, I had a look to see some of the design outlines featured. I noticed on page 3 of the 2nd heading (on left) that there is a basic rendering of the Makkasan Redevelopment featuring lots of buildings, a fairly large observation tower, a convention centre, some large arch type structure and thankfully lots fo green, open space :)

However, I know that the planning process for the redevlopment has been fairly secretive so I am wondering if this rendering is a basic outline of the actual project or just one of the options being considered??

I am assuming that one of the rot fai members will know as I understand that they are requesting a Railway Museum be built as part of the redevelopment and one assumes to save the numerous old rail stock on site from being scrapped.

[jpatokal]

Nobody knows. See also previous thread (http://www.angkor.com/2bangkok/2bangkok/forum/showthread.php?t=571) about this.

[ncr]

I noticed on page 3 of the 2nd heading (on left) that there is a basic rendering of the Makkasan Redevelopment featuring lots of buildings, a fairly large observation tower, a convention centre, some large arch type structure and thankfully lots fo green, open space :) You mean this one: http://www.ntbr.org/images/info/info15.jpg ? Looks cool..... Strange though, the caption (above the image) says "Phahonyothin Transportation Center". It's not easy to make out where the site depicted in the rendering really is. But on all those pages they seem to be talking about the Northern Line to Rangsit, not the Eastern Line.......

[Pas]

Khun Yappofloyd, Jpat, Nils

That artist impression is depicting the proposed Paholyothin Center development not Makkasan railyard redevelopment. The Paholyothin Center primarily covers area around Bang Sue train station (behind Jatujak market, Queens Sirikit Park) bounded by Paholyothin Road to the south. All SRT own land.

The master plan for Paholyothin Center was prepared in 1998 or thereabout, in conjunction with the Bangkok Terminal project - see link on 2b mainpage under the heading "Remembering Sun Estate Mo Chit".. it's the proposed commercial complex above the BTS depot at Mo Chit that never eventuate (also check this website http://www.bangkokterminal.com)..
I don't know if the Paholyothin plan is still relevant.. may be it is since the northern commuter line is being revived?

Paholyothin Center is divided into 3 zones which corellate to three different stages of implementation. Zone 1 is primarily commercial development focused around the Bangkok Transport Terminal (within this zone there is very tall observation / telecommunication tower). Zone 2 include convention centers and residential communities with many highrise buildings. Zone 3, the last stage of development is planned for hi-tech and research centers..

The masterplan is going to be implemented over a 20-30 year period. It was prepared by a group of consultant: A-Seven Corporation, SJA+3D and Creative Design. I'm not 100% sure who commissioned the masterplan, although most likely a joint effort between BMA, Transport Ministry and SRT...

BTW I have some more info on this project (maps + photos of the model) which I have passed it on to Ron so he may post it soon.. ;)

[Yappofloyd]

Khun Yappofloyd, Jpat, Nils

That artist impression is depicting the proposed Paholyothin Center development not Makkasan railyard redevelopment. The Paholyothin Center primarily covers area around Bang Sue train station (behind Jatujak market, Queens Sirikit Park) bounded by Paholyothin Road to the south. All SRT own land.

Khun ncr & Pas,

Thankyou for pointing out my mistake....I obviously don't read thai and assumed that it was Makkasan being about the airport link but I was wondering where in the rendering Bayoike was...

I remembering reading something about the Paholyothin Center redevelop. and keep wondering what the heck is proposed for all that SRT land so it is good to have it clarified.

Pas, so is the plan still relevant as the proposed BTT on the website doesn't really resemble the somewhat messy New MoChit Terminal?

So should probably rename this thread.....,

[Yappofloyd]

Khun Pas,

Thank you for sending Ron the various maps and designsof Paholyothin Center proposals. :) Very interesting...

I was surprised to see a mono-rail proposed to run around the whole and, I assume, provide a link between other transportation systems/centres.

[Pas]

I was surprised to see a mono-rail proposed to run around the whole and, I assume, provide a link between other transportation systems/centres.
Yes a monorial is proposed to provide linkage to the different transit stations (eg. new Bang Sue station and Mo Chit BTS station) and also facilitate movements within the complex.

[Wisarut]

Khun Pas,

Waikt until I could borrow the SRT Annual Report of BE 2543 and you'll see the colorful version othe Makkasan Transportation Center and Phaholyothin Transportation center ... Too bad National Library have NOT received that annual rport yet ... and Thammasart University has just received that annual report but have NO color photocopy machine to deal with this matter .... :D

[GWR]

Scroll half-way down (http://www.cabinet.thaigov.go.th/eng/pol_05.htm)
Policy Statement of The Council of Ministers of Prime Minister Colonel Phya Phahon Phonpayuhasena
Delivered to Parliament
on Monday, 25 December 1933
QUOTE
1. Department of Railways

The government shall resolute the Bangkok station, as for the better safety and convenience for the people and passangers. It shall be complete in year 1936.

The government shall construct the new interchange railway station at Bang Sue, equiped with the lighthouse. It shall be complete in year 1935.

The construction of parallel railways shall continue from Klong Rangsit to Ban Pachee, ending up at Bang Pa In, and shall be complete in year 1938, 4 years in total.

The railway construction from Khon Khen to Nong Khai shall be finished in 4 years,
just put on the track from 541 to 571 kilometer mark, establish a bridge from 474 to 541kilometer mark, ground a rock from 496 to 541 kilometer mark, and set up the office. The government shall launch services to Kumpawapee, in year 1938, Udonthani, in year 1939, and Nong Khai, in year 1941.

END OF QUOTE

[Wisarut]

Well, I think they are refering to the spotlight tower at Bangsue Jucntion ...

[GWR]

I suspect that's it. A large marshalling yard would need a large spotlight. Was that just a guess? Does it still exist or has it ever existed? If so, I guess it would make a good photo op.

[Wisarut]

That Spotlight DOES Exists and I have seen that Spotlight in action at Bangsue though

[Wisarut]

Now, the contractors are working on the iron bridge across Prapa canal (the main water source of Bangkokians) as well as the section from Bangsue to
Rama 6 bridge .... replacing the wooden sleepers with concrete sleepers and 70 Lb steel rails with 100 lb rails on the outbound track Therefore, the traffic switching for Southern train has to be imposed. The Outbound Southern trains have to used the new track (the inbound track) from Bangsue to Bang Bumru before switching back to the old track ...

Now, Rama 6 bridge has been reinforced to allow 20 Ton axle load

[dick]

In front of the Bangsue station, behind the fence of the small market, just opposite the endstation of the metro, I saw some tracks. Is this a rest of the tram?

[Wisarut]

Yep, ther used to be tram line from Bang Krabue Intersection to Bangsue Junction via Kiak Kai (Tha Harn road) ... running form 1926 to 1962.

This line used single car tram though :) :rolleyes:

[GWR]

Not part of the old cement works sidings is it?

[von Hirschhorn]

Good old lord, I always thought I saw it all. Just been to the spot last October and many times before but never find the track you obliviously discover. Sure this is not some hidden ex SRT track from a former siding or so. Well, we shall discuss this later and yes again to Bangsue next time.:cool:

[dick]

I've made pictures of the remnants. One part from about one or two meters single track, just behind the fence. Behind the fence behind the small market double track, several meters.

[pong]

As I am jsut back here in BKk after a 8 month stay elsewhere I visited BangSue yesterday and saw a nice new covered, but openair footbridge spanning all its tracks. It is just south of the SaiThai platforms,a little north of the North platform. It links to an (empty) carpark, mainly to serve subway users, I thin: walk over bridge, then walk back in tunnal UNDER the SRT-tracks to the actual subway platform=good forkeeping fit for lazy cardrivers. But I am posting here as its a real good vantage point for foto-makers.
Does anyoneknow if one can contnuue (by foot) further east,along the SRT-container yard to reach Mochit or so?? Dontwant to get lost/or spend toolong in the sun to find out you cannot.

[Jromerz]

I have walked from Mochit to Bang Sue station before. I went straight through the railway yard, across all the tracks, between the trains, etc.. Very interesting to see all the abandoned SRT stuff, pity I didn't have my camera with me at the time otherwise there would be many good pics to share. As far as I can remember, there was no paved road going all the way between Bang Sue and Mochit, but there was some semi-paved or dirt road. No body stopped me from exploring the area, and the few SRT employees that I saw didn't seem to have any problem with it - not sure how they would react if all the 2bangkok forum readership started going for excursions there though... :D
I had actually asked one of the employees at the Mochit (sub)station how I could go on foot to Bang Sue, and they just pointed across the yard and told me that was the way to go :p
So yes, it is possible to go between the two .. and there is a lot of interesting (some historical) stuff to see on the way.

[dick]

Pong, there is a lot of work to do...............maybe you can find an old tram boogiecar between the old SRT stuff, as our other railfan J.ez. mentioned.:D
I'm looking forward the pictures.

[DannyS]

Hello Everyone

Last Sunday morning I took a walk through the railway yards at Bangsue for exercise. I have a few questions that I hope the experts on this forum can answer and I took some photos to illustrate them.

Is the armoured railcar on display at the Kamphaengphet Road end the same one or same model as the one in this thread (http://www.angkor.com/2bangkok/2bangkok/forum/showthread.php?t=2240) and shown in this picture (http://www.2bangkok.com/2bangkok/srt/srtbld/SRT13.jpg)? Are these the same pair of armoured cars as R.Ramaer refers to in his book "The Railways of Thailand" as being from a batch made in England for the Emergency in Malaya? My picture of it is below.
http://www.dco.co.th/download/aromoured-railcar-400px.jpg

Is the steam locomotive in a bad state of repair also on display near the armoured car one of the Krauss 2-4-0Ts from the Maeklong line, and is it, (I hope not), the same one shown in Ramaer's book, (page 64), in Makkasan looking in far better condition? Again my picture below.
http://www.dco.co.th/download/loco-400px.jpg

Does anyone know the story on the damaged carriage in the picture below?
http://www.dco.co.th/download/crashed-carriage-400px.jpg

Last question :) Does the library train at Bangsue Station open during the week and are the books for children only? The old Birmingham made wooden carriage is superb. Last picture below.

http://www.dco.co.th/download/library-train-400px.jpg

Thanks
Danny

[kevsmith]

there are some more of these coaches at the chatauchak museum and one nicely preserved near the diesel railcar depot at nakhon ratchasima
the tender behind the 2-4-0T is from one of the RHB 2-8-0s

[von Hirschhorn]

Concerning the armored cars, this is not the same as from the picture. The latter stands at a play garden for children opposite the Railway Police headquarters, next to the main office of the SRT.
When I started exploring Thai Railways in the eighties, one of these vehicles was on plinth at Uttaradit and another one in a dilapidated state on the so called ‘grave yard’ at the end of the Makkasan workshop, a swampy marshland were all sorts of stock was dumped and still enjoy their rusty life.
As is the case for a lot of ‘old things’ from the rail, it shifts through the years.

About the Krauss machines, this is not the only one survived.
Nº 6 works number 6021 – 1908 stands in front of the head office. In 1987 this machine stood near the Bang Sue depot entrance / later replaced by nº 7
Note that Nº 7 is older than Nº 6 maybe a change in numbers somewhere in time?
Nº 7 works number 5427 – 1905 stands in front of the Bang Sue diesel depot entrance.
And there’s also Nº 3 works number 5418 – 1906 near the entrance of the Siam Country Club near Pattaya.

The one on the Kampheng Phet road is another survivor and a very good example how the mind of preserving is working, or better spoken; doesn’t work at all. Wind and weather have a free game. A rusty monument, one good thing: it’s not the last survivor.

[DannyS]

Thanks for the answers. This Sunday morning I tried a walk around Makasan. Not as much fun and couldn't really get in anywhere. Not sure where next week's walk will be.

[GWR]

10 Febuary 2008
SRT to pay medical treatments to passengers of Bang Sue accident

The State Railway of Thailand (SRT) Deputy Governor, Mr. Nakhon Chantarasorn (นคร จันทรศร), insists that SRT will be responsible for the medical expenses to passengers who have encountered the train accident at Bang Sue station yesterday at 17.35.

The No-112 train running from Denchai (เด่นชัย) to Bangkok parked at the station to wait to change its locomotive. With the slippery rails caused by oil spills, the assembled locomotive crashed heavily at a passenger bogie. The accident led to 10 injuries.

Mr. Nakhon says now the injured are being hospitalized in Bangpho (บางโพ) Hospital and SRT promises to be responsible for all expenses incurred from their medications.
http://thainews.prd.go.th/newsenglish/previewnews.php?news_id=255102100001

[von Hirschhorn]

I like to make a note about this accident.
Nobody seems to wonder why there be a change of locomotives on a train coming in to the Hua Lamphong station at the only 7 km + 470 meter away Bang Sue station.
Well, the one who started the 112 obviously was in need for maintenance and since the level crossings between Bang Sue and Hua Lamphong (HL) are clogged anyway why bothering by sending the machine back alone to Bang Sue where the main diesel locomotive depot is situated. So instead a fresh locomotive is coupled and after arrival at HL available for further duty. (Any outbound train)
For the same reason as mentioned above sometimes a locomotive for new duties and coming from the depot, is put in front of the train without changing. [in this case the original locomotive will stay at HL for another duty too]
An oily and slippery rail, yes, possible, but the locomotive has a sand dome. To much speed? Routine? All possible!
The only thing that could prevent accidents like this is what I have written in my story Northern Miscellaneous: To solve the problem of crossings with cars in a gridlock is a case of priority and firm decisions. Only the brave can save the city for further disaster. If any train would have an obstacle free flow between HL and Bang Sue, the change of locomotive was not necessary. Unfortunate; train or traffic, that’s the question; on limited space you cannot have it all.