Yellow Brown Pink Public Hearing

[Phrakanong]

Does anyone know what is happening with the proposed Lard Phrao line? I notice this does not seem to be a priority with the govt at the moment, which I find a bit surprising, given the significant traffic congestion I always experience on this road.

Also, what is the latest proposal? I seem to recall something about an elevated rail/monorail proposal at some stage, although I've seen another map (can't recall where) which seemed to indicate the Lard Phrao line would be an extension of the subway?

[The Enforcer!]

Lard Phrao line?

Was this the 'yellow line' in the Taksin election con of 2001?

The Enforcer!

[Phrakanong]

Not sure about 2001, but it definitely appears as the yellow line (Lat Phrao to Sri Nagarindra) in the 2005 map on this website: http://www.2bangkok.com/2bangkok/MassTransit/map/map.shtml

On the 2005 map, it appears under the "MRT Metro" section, so I am assuming at that stage they were talking about it being a subway? However, I also saw discussions elsewhere suggesting it would be elevated. I'm quite confused. I would obviously prefer the subway as it is less invasive and having an elevated structure can be a bit of an eyesore.

[The Enforcer!]

Cannot imagine it was underground and Srinakarin has a lot of room for skytrain style tracks.

The Enforcer!

[Yappofloyd]

Not sure about 2001, but it definitely appears as the yellow line (Lat Phrao to Sri Nagarindra) in the 2005 map on this website: http://www.2bangkok.com/2bangkok/MassTransit/map/map.shtml

On the 2005 map, it appears under the "MRT Metro" section, so I am assuming at that stage they were talking about it being a subway? However, I also saw discussions elsewhere suggesting it would be elevated. I'm quite confused. I would obviously prefer the subway as it is less invasive and having an elevated structure can be a bit of an eyesore.

Given the ongoing delays and uncertainty regarding the current 5 priority lines it is hard to see the yellow line getting the go ahead prior to the end of the decade if then. I suspect that most likely it would not get built until after 2015 . I would think that the east part of the orange line is more of a priority being an important east- west link for all of the proposed north south lines and given that it would serve the busy Bangkapi area.

However, a smart govt would realise that with the Mo Chit BTS and MRT current lines, it would be relatively cheap to approve the Lat Phrao line from MRT to Bang Kapi along Th Lat Phrao which is currently a transit mess. Then with the opening of the airport line, the ext from Bangkapi to the airport line could be built.

This could be built fairly quickly (2-3) years if BTS to serve the NW area of Bangkok. I think MRT would be preerable along Lat Phrao and through Bangkapi especially given the flyovers.

[Nekochan]

Hi, dear 2BKK friends,

OTP is starting a feasibility study of yellow (Lad Prao), pink and brown lines. I remembered they had a rough figures from PCI(?). The ridership of the yellow line is 150,000 pass/day in the opening year (after 2012?). It came out that they may design an elevated LRT along Lad Prao-Sri Nakarin.

BTS is LRT? If it is so, it will look like BTS.:rolleyes:

Nippon Koei is the lead firm, I think. But it seems strange that OTP wants to do the FS, not MRTA.

Pink line was politically motivated by TRT (do not pay much attention). Brown line is the extension of orange line.

One difficult thing for the yellow line is how to construct both LRT and expressway on the same Sri Nakarin corridor. It is a mess that there are too many agencies in charge. Oh!, there is a BRT line on Sri Nakarin as well!

I hope to dig more information (must be from OTP's people). As far as I recall, it was designed as LRT (2 car train, some thing like that).

[Phrakanong]

Is it confirmed that they are considering an elevated light rail? Most LRT's that I saw listed on wikipedia seemed to suggest more of a tram type arrangement with tracks built into the road... also I would consider this to be amusing in current day Bangkok (too bad I never got to see Bangkok in the tram days).

If its elevated, it will be interesting to see how they integrate it with other elevated structures.

[Nekochan]

The latest development is:

Yellow and Pink Lines are perhaps, monorail. There is no confirmation they will definitely be monorail. But considering monorail structures are lighter and they cost less...and they look more pleasent. (Check wikipedia)

This source may be right?

BTS look alike structures on Lad Prao and Chang Wattana are very unlikely. BTS is somewhat LRT by nature, so it does not fit in the category.

So my conclusion = MONORAIL:cool:

Expect to see lobbies from monorail manufactures on newspaper.

BRT routes on both corridors are very impractical, with duplicated service. (BMA will not love to hear this)

Openning year? Unkhown but must be after the first 7 MRT lines are completed.

[GWR]

13 November 2007
OTP to arrange public hearing on construction of three electric train routes

Director of the Office of Transport and Traffic Policy and Planning (OTP), Maitri Srinarawat (ไมตรี ศรีนราวัฒน์), reports that OTP will arrange the first public hearing on the construction of three electric train routes on November 16.

The three electric train routes include the Lat Phrao – Sam Rong (ลาดพร้าว-สำโรง) or yellow route, the Bang Kapi – Min Buri (บางกะปิ-มีนบุรี) or brown route, and the Khae Rai – Suwinthawong (แคลาย-สุวินทวงศ์) or pink route. According to the director, the construction plans of the three routes still lack necessary details. The public hearing will contribute ideas to authorities to the frrequencies and the number of passengers expected to use the three routes.

The yellow route stretches 32 kilometers, the pink route at 33 kilometers and the brown route at 9.5 kilometers. The three routes consist of both sky trains and underground trains.

http://thainews.prd.go.th/newsenglish/previewnews.php?news_id=255011130026

[The Enforcer!]

Lat Phrao – Sam Rong (ลาดพร้าว-สำโรง) or yellow route, the Bang Kapi – Min Buri (บางกะปิ-มีนบุรี) or brown route, and the Khae Rai – Suwinthawong or pink route


The Yellow Route I know and it is 100% skytrain style.

The Brown Route surely connects with nothing as it stands?

The Pink Route is new to me .... where are Khae Rai and Suwinthawong?

The Enforcer!

[TGunner]

10 km of the yellow line is underground:
http://www.bangkokmasstransit.com/picimages/images/YELLOW-LINE.gif

For all other routes:
http://www.bangkokmasstransit.com/

[The Enforcer!]

10 km of the yellow line is underground:


Sorry about that! Not sure why it should be underground when Lad Prao is wide enough to accommodate a skytrain system.

The Enforcer!

[The Enforcer!]

http://www.bangkokmasstransit.com/

Great site! Thanks,

The Enforcer!

[Wisarut]

Sorry about that! Not sure why it should be underground when Lad Prao is wide enough to accommodate a skytrain system.

The Enforcer!

Because thsoe who live in lad Phrao still perceive that undergroudn track take less land exappropriation thant elevated track .... even thohgh the fact had said OTHERWISE!

[Wisarut]

1. Yellow Line - pleasing those who live along Lad Phrao Road and Sri Nakharin ... allowing those who live in Lad Phrao and Sri Nakharin to reach Hua Mark railway station ... for Eastern line intercity and Airport Link ...

However, it would be a lot better if this yellow line connects with red line commuter at either Bangsue or Km11 (Chatuchak) because it would be a replacement of the aborted Bangsue - Klong Tan line.

2. Pink line - pleasing thsoe who live in Nonthaburi City, Pakkret City, Chaeng Watthana road and Ram Indra road (Me too ! :p ;) :) :D :cool: ). However, it would better if the line go through Minburi Market instead of highway 304 whcih passes Tesco Lotus because it would allow the interchange with BMTA buses as well as the intercity buses from Mochit 2 to eastern region.

3. Brown line ... bter turn them into a part of Orange line as it should be sicne 1995.

[waerth]

I always thought the orange line had been cancelled by previous government. I would love it if they got around to building that. Then again I have been here since 1999 and had to put up with the mess on ratchada for a long time ....

Love the subway though :)

Waerth

[TGunner]

I always thought the orange line had been cancelled by previous government. I would love it if they got around to building that. Then again I have been here since 1999 and had to put up with the mess on ratchada for a long time ....

Love the subway though :)

Waerth

I read somewhere that the orange line is on the Democrats' agenda. But they want to build the line in 2 phrases. The first phrase starts from Thai Cultural Center and ends at Bang Kapi and then the 2nd phrase is for the rest of the line. Hmmm, hopefully khun Apisit will be the next prime minister and build this line asap! :D

The Enforcer, you're welcome krab. :)

[TGunner]

From www.bangkokmasstransit.com :

http://www.bangkokmasstransit.com/imageboucher/map2000.gif

[Wisarut]

Just the first 10 Km from Bang Kapi to Thailand Cultural center is not enouhg ... the minimum would be from bang Kapi to Victory Monument to allow Ramkhamhaeng student to reahc Victory Monument and Pratoo Nam ....

Furthermroe, the interchange betwene Dindaeng station at dindaeng Y Intersection and Rajprarob of Airport Transdeit is in urgent need.

[TGunner]

Just the first 10 Km from Bang Kapi to Thailand Cultural center is not enouhg ... the minimum would be from bang Kapi to Victory Monument to allow Ramkhamhaeng student to reahc Victory Monument and Pratoo Nam ....

Furthermroe, the interchange betwene Dindaeng station at dindaeng Y Intersection and Rajprarob of Airport Transdeit is in urgent need.


I agree krab khun Wisarut that they should at least build it to Victory Monument. This line and the pink line have always been in my dreams! :p

And by the way, I've looked at OTP website. They have just surveyed the area for the construction of the link between the blue line and ARL krab. It will be a tunnel for people to walk between the Blue line (Petburi) and ARL (Makasan) stations. No words about when or how it will be built though. Here's the link to the story (in Thai): http://www.otp.go.th/dailynews/meeting_061150/meeting_061150.htm

A couple of pictures of the survey team:
http://www.otp.go.th/dailynews/meeting_061150/2a.gif
http://www.otp.go.th/dailynews/meeting_061150/5a.gif
http://www.otp.go.th/dailynews/meeting_061150/12a.gif

[Wisarut]

H mmmm Better sign MOU between MRTA and SRt about both Joint ticket and connecting building betwen Airport Link and Blue ring ...

[The Enforcer!]

H mmmm Better sign MOU between MRTA and SRt about both Joint ticket and connecting building betwen Airport Link and Blue ring ...
Pity they cannot use something like London's Oyster which, in Bangkok's case, would give you use of Skytrain, Underground, Airlink, BRT and even BMTA buses! The program itself calculates how much of your journey was on which operator in order that everyone gets correct share of income.

The Enforcer!

[Wisarut]

Yellow lien has the best chance to be concieved sicne it pass through business and comemrcial area along Lad Phrao road, crosses Airport Transit at Hua Mark and passes commercial & resident areas alogn Sri Nakharin road ... There are already strong demands for this Yellow line from wthsoe who work and live alogn Lad Phrao - Sri Nakharin road .... whcih keep banging the door of MRTA for this route ....

The ONLY catch is the giant warterwork pipelines/tunnels along Lad Phrao road ... How MRTA and OTP are goign to handle is anotehr story .... :rolleyes:

[Yappofloyd]

Just the first 10 Km from Bang Kapi to Thailand Cultural center is not enouhg ... the minimum would be from bang Kapi to Victory Monument to allow Ramkhamhaeng student to reahc Victory Monument and Pratoo Nam ....

Furthermroe, the interchange betwene Dindaeng station at dindaeng Y Intersection and Rajprarob of Airport Transdeit is in urgent need.

Totally agree, the more important section is the Victory to Ramkhamhaeng so this should be built first, as just linking to the Blue Line won't do that much for many.

The new govt. should make this line and the Yellow from Lad Phrao to Bangkapi to Airport line priorities to cover the NE. Along with the Airport/Red Line missing link from Phaya Thai to Yomarat and Bang Sue. These three would fill in some gaps assuming that all the other 5 lines get built.....

The second stage (in terms of these three lines) should then be the remainder of the yellow to Seacon and Samrong and the Brown line to Min Buri. The west side of the Orange could perhaps wait as I think the BTS Phran Nok is more of a priority than the Orange given that the Blue and Red to Tailng Chan will creat some Pinklao links.

[Wisarut]

Totally agree, the more important section is the Victory to Ramkhamhaeng so this should be built first, as just linking to the Blue Line won't do that much for many.

The new govt. should make this line and the Yellow from Lad Phrao to Bangkapi to Airport line priorities to cover the NE. Along with the Airport/Red Line missing link from Phaya Thai to Yomarat and Bang Sue. These three would fill in some gaps assuming that all the other 5 lines get built.....

The second stage (in terms of these three lines) should then be the remainder of the yellow to Seacon and Samrong and the Brown line to Min Buri. The west side of the Orange could perhaps wait as I think the BTS Phran Nok is more of a priority than the Orange given that the Blue and Red to Tailng Chan will creat some Pinklao links.

Well even thoug hthsoe who live alogn lad Prhao road are askign for ytellow line ... those residernts alogn Sri nakharin road also urge the governemtn to build this Yellow line -> creatign the tug of war to get this rotue goign near theri areas first .... despite of budget constrain ....

[TGunner]

Along with the Airport/Red Line missing link from Phaya Thai to Yomarat and Bang Sue.
.

According to the info on the OTP website, this section of ARL is being designed in detail right now. And it's scheduled to be completed in Jan 2008. So hopefully not long after that, the new gov't (I suppose the current gov't won't be able to approve any mega projects by then) will approve its construction phase (and will be able to find the funding as well.)

[GWR]

Mass-transit routes 'must take financial viability into account'
Published on November 19, 2007

The new government should incorporate a commercial approach in the construction of mass-transit routes in Greater Bangkok to increase their financial viability and enable several lines to be built at one time.

To maximise revenue from properties at new stations and along the routes, the city plan may need to be adjusted to increase maximum saleable area, panellists at a Krungthep Turakij rail development seminar heard last week.

President and chief executive of Ananda Development, Chanond Ruangkritya, said many investors would be interested in bidding for property-development proposals if the government opted to invite them.

"The private sector is ready to raise funds for the development. Many investors have shown interest. A Dubai investor also told me so," Chanond said.

Office of Transport and Traffic Policy and Planning (OTP) director-general Maitree Srinarawat said the Thaksin administration proposed to invite private-sector bidders for property development.

Maitree and Sombat Kitjalaksana, managing director of Bangkok Metro, the operator of Thailand's first subway, were in favour of the idea, saying it would save government money.

The six lines approved by the interim government last November are expected to cost Bt165 billion. The government has so far opened bidding for part of the Red Line, from Bang Sue to Taling Chan. Bidding for the Purple Line is expected soon, but none of it allows simultaneous property development.

According to Maitree, the lines would be linked by five main sub-centres, which included huge potential for property development.

Chanond said floor-area ratios would need to be increased. Floor-area ratios put a ceiling on saleable space relative to actual land size.

He said while the ratio was 7:1 along Sukhumvit to Onnuj, the ratio from Onnuj to Soi Baring, where the Skytrain extension will run to, was only 5:1. This is unattractive for investment, he said.

"Is it possible to allow a ratio of 10:1 for all plots around train stations, regardless of zoning?" he asked.

Bangkok Metropolitan Administration (BMA) urban development planning division director Panyapat Noppun said the city plan was governed by a master law which did not allow relaxation on a case-by-case basis.

"That could be done only when we have a council which has a final say on what projects should enjoy higher privileges," she said.

She said the ratio was defined in line with infrastructure availability and that if it was not, the city would expand without limit.

She said there had been some relaxation of the ratio along Ratchadaphisek Road. Extra-large buildings are allowed, even though the area is zoned residential. As a result of the subway, the BMA plans to charge passenger cars to use the road.

Large buildings with park-and-ride services for train commuters are given a "bonus", whereby they are allowed to increase saleable space.

All the panellists were hopeful the planned rail construction would not be subject to any changes, considering the benefits of mass transit in reducing traffic, energy consumption and accidents.

The OTP estimated there were 17 million commuter trips a day within Greater Bangkok. Only 700,000 trips are made on the Skytrain and subway, while 6.5 million are on public buses and 10 million in personal vehicles.

Maitree is hopeful that once the city has a train network with a combined length of 137 kilometres within the next five years it will accommodate at least three million commuters.

"Bidding could be done for all the planned lines if the government wanted. Traffic congestion caused by construction could be reduced if the structures were built at warehouses and transferred for assembly at the sites," Maitree said.

He admitted the only bar to such massive bidding was the public demand for a transparent bidding process.

Achara Deboonme
The Nation

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2007/11/19/business/business_30056565.php

[Wisarut]

First Serminar for 3 new lines

Thairath - 17 Nov 2007

The first Serminar on 3 lines was held at TK Palace Hotel (Opposite to Big C Chaneg Watthana) on 16 Nov 2007
.
OTP has shown that it is NOt conclusive abotu the end of each line

1. 35 km Yellow Line (Lad Phrao - Sri Nakharin - Samrong), there are 5 options for the end of this line
1.1 Connect with BTSC at Samrong (oroginal 2000)
1.2 Connect with BTSC at Bang na intersection - via BITEC & central City Bang Na
1.3 Connect with BTSC at Samutprakarn PEA (end of Sri Nakharin road)
1.4 Double conection with BTSC at Bang Na and Samrong
1.5 Double conection with BTSC at Bang Na and Samutprakarn PEA (end of Sri Nakharin road)

2. 10 km Brown Line, ther are 2 choices for this route
2.1 connecting ornage line Ban Ma canal ... and following Ram Khamhaeng road all the way to Suwnthawong and connect with Pink line at Suwinthawongse -> original idea as the extension of Ornage line in 1995.

2.2 connecting Yellow line at Lum Salee and then go along Ram Khamhaeng road all the way to Suwnthawong and connect with Pink line at Suwinthawongse -> modified idea to cope with the perrenial traffic jam at Lam Salee - Bang Kapi

3. Pink line - Kae Rai - Suwinthawong - 2 CHoices for the route

The Beginng in at either places
3.1.1 Kae Rai intersectionin frotn of Ministry of Public Health
3.1.2 the new Nonthaburi provincial Hall on Ratanathibet

The end at either place
3.2.1 Suwingthawongse (original idea)
3.2.2 follwoign Sihaburanukij road

There are several choice such as
1. At grade BRT
2. Elevated BRT,
3. At grade LRT
4. Elevated LRT
5. Elevated Monorail
6. Elevated Heavy rail

The studies will be done in Ocotber 2008

SInce this serminar was held in chaeng attana area, most attendances would focus on Pink line. One thing to worry is the traffic jam dureing the construction ... Many local peole have poiinted out the chronic traffic jam durign the constructin of Chaeng watthana flyover which cause unnecessary stress and strains due to the delays of construction by the incompetent contractors.

Most have REJECTED BRT on the ground that it is more efficient than bus or BRT ...

[Wisarut]

Second Serminar on 3 new mass ransit lines
Thairath - 23 Nov 2007

There was the second serminar on 3 new mass transit lines at King park Avenue Hotel, Sri Nakharin on 21 Nov 2007. There were 170 attendign the serminar includign deputy Governor of Samut Prakarn.

Deputy Governor of Samut Prakarn said she has NO objection on the Yellow lien which passed throug Samut Prakarn .... since the chronic traffic jam at Samutprakarn is worsdening ... even Southern Kanchanaphisek expressway and industrial Ring have relieved traffic jam somewhat ....

However, she prefer to have the yellow lien connect with BTS skytrain at Bang Na or bearing since the line from Bearing to Paknam would not be implemented for a while until the settlement between BMA and Samut Prakarn City hall is done ... unless Paknam Extension of BTS is DONE first ....

Anotehr reason for Yellow line is the connection with Airprot Link at Hua Mark. Goign through BTS alogn to Phyathai take too logn time for those who live in Pak Nam.


There are several choices such as
1. At grade BRT
2. Elevated BRT,
3. At grade LRT
4. Elevated LRT
5. Elevated Monorail - the same as Tokyo monorail
6. Elevated Monorail - the same as chiba Monorail.
7. Elevated Electrifierd railway
8. Elevated Heavy rail
9. Underground Heavy Rail

Note: I guess that Elevated Heavy rail for the section from Lam Salee to Saomrong (or Bang Na) ....

[Wisarut]

More from Public Hearing
Manager Weekly 26 Nov - 2 Dec 2007

The cost to construct Subway (undergroudn heavy) - 3500 Million Baht/km
The cost to construct Skytrain (elevated heavy)- 700-800 Million Baht/km

Ticket Price 10-20 Baht + 1.8X => X = Number of travelling Km.

the local people said either elevated heavy (Skytrain) or BRT would be fine .. even though they prefer elevated heavy (Skytrain).

Note, If it is a decision to award Yellow line to BMA, it will create the ring line (for Bankok side of Chao Phraya of course!) ... but need to add the extension from Lad Phrao to Ratchayothin to complete the ring.

[Yappofloyd]

More from Public Hearing
Manager Weekly 26 Nov - 2 Dec 2007

Note, If it is a decision to award Yellow line to BMA, it will create the ring line (for Bankok side of Chao Phraya of course!) ... but need to add the extension from Lad Phrao to Ratchayothin to complete the ring.

Khun Wisarut, not sure what you mean by a ring line?

If the whole yeelow line eventually gets built and links up with the longer planned/potential Purple Line at Samrong then are you suggestion a ring line could run on the Blue Line from Tao Pun back to Lad Phrao?

Of course it would take 20-30 years to get to this stage based on slowly everyhting is getting built.

[The Enforcer!]

Of course it would take 20-30 years to get to this stage based on slowly everyhting is getting built.
Aren't we being a little over optimistic here?

The Enforcer!

[gwmss15]

A Better route for Mini Buri would be to extend from klong toei subway station on rama 4. Running via Rama 4 rd, Sukhumvit soi 71, ramkhamhaeng rd, bang kapi, seri thai rd to min buri market ALL SUBWAY.

a better route for ladprow rd would be run as extension from Lad prow MRT station along Ladprow rd untill bang kapi then along sri nakarin rd to the pharak rd to samarong BIG C/Imperial. ALL subway along ladprow rd and untill after hua mark station then SKY train style to samarong with connection to BTS line so the one station could be shared for both line.

scrap the orange line not needed east of ratchdaphesik rd might be ok to the west side and into thonburi. complete via sriindhorn rd and ratchawithi rd and dindeang to suttisarn MRT all subway.

complete BTS extension to bang kae via phet kesam rd, Complete BTS to sapahan mai via phanon yothin rd. Complere BTS extension to paknam market area. ALL BTS style.

Create a BRT route from Klong toei station to RAMA 2 mahachai mai via rama 3 area. the roads are quite wide in this area could support BRT route well.

Create BTS route along chaeng watthana and ram indra rd ( ie pak kret to min buri market connects with BTS at lak si circle and SRT lak si stations and MIN buri MRT stations.

Create an at grade BTS line from the new BTS line at wong wein yai to mahachai city via the existing SRT line. ie this line becomes BTS route not SRT. All the old mahachai SRT line stuff get transferred to maeklong line with new passing loops to create a every 30 min service down there.

Create SRT electrified commuter line from ayutthaya to bangsue and onward to makkasarn and hualampong station. 3 tracks all the way from ayutthaya to hualamphong with grade separation for all roads should be enough.Create electrified SRT line from nakorn pathom to bangsue via taling chan


Complete MRT blue ring line in thon buri with link via wong wein yai to new BTS line close to siam university. Complete purple line as is but extend to bung bua thong. Create BTS line from national stadium station via sanam luang and pink lao areas to new southern bus terminal with possiable link to SRT line near kanchana phisek rd.

[Wisarut]

A Better route for Mini Buri would be to extend from klong toei subway station on rama 4. Running via Rama 4 rd, Sukhumvit soi 71, ramkhamhaeng rd, bang kapi, seri thai rd to min buri market ALL SUBWAY.

Elevated section from Bangkapi to Minburi would be more cost effective.

a better route for ladprow rd would be run as extension from Lad prow MRT station along Ladprow rd untill bang kapi then along sri nakarin rd to the pharak rd to samarong BIG C/Imperial. ALL subway along ladprow rd and untill after hua mark station then SKY train style to samarong with connection to BTS line so the one station could be shared for both line. .
That's way they are goign to do so ... However, the elevated wsection will be from Bang Kapi to Samrong via Thepharak though ... It will interchange at Poochao Samingphrai station of BTS (Paknam extension) though.

scrap the orange line not needed east of ratchdaphesik rd might be ok to the west side and into thonburi. complete via sriindhorn rd and ratchawithi rd and dindeang to suttisarn MRT all subway.

What about the Orange route that passes Ratchamangla Stadium and Ramkhamhaeng U. ? This section deserve the new line ANYWAY.

complete BTS extension to bang kae via phet kesam rd, Complete BTS to sapahan mai via phanon yothin rd. Complere BTS extension to paknam market area. ALL BTS style.

MRTA would NOT allow BTS and BMA to do so ... unless they have made a fair trade of their route!

Create a BRT route from Klong toei station to RAMA 2 mahachai mai via rama 3 area. the roads are quite wide in this area could support BRT route well.

Maybe

Create BTS route along chaeng watthana and ram indra rd ( ie pak kret to min buri market connects with BTS at lak si circle and SRT lak si stations and MIN buri MRT stations.

Sounds Good.

Create an at grade BTS line from the new BTS line at wong wein yai to mahachai city via the existing SRT line. ie this line becomes BTS route not SRT. All the old mahachai SRT line stuff get transferred to maeklong line with new passing loops to create a every 30 min service down there.

NO Way! SRT would NOTY allow ANYBOEDY else to play aroudn on theri land unless they get a fair share of revenue sharing!

Create SRT electrified commuter line from ayutthaya to bangsue and onward to makkasarn and hualampong station. 3 tracks all the way from ayutthaya to hualamphong with grade separation for all roads should be enough.Create electrified SRT line from nakorn pathom to bangsue via taling chan

That's theing SRT Board are going to do so. However, they have to get aroudn with thsoe SRT Union ... even they need to hinre someone to stangualte thsoe Union members ...


Complete MRT blue ring line in thon buri with link via wong wein yai to new BTS line close to siam university. Complete purple line as is but extend to bung bua thong.

SUre, That's thing MRTA would like to do so.

Create BTS line from national stadium station via sanam luang and pink lao areas to new southern bus terminal with possiable link to SRT line near kanchana phisek rd.

Sure Thjat's BTSC and BMA would klike to do so .... but they have to remove those committtee who are on theri way FIRST.

[gwmss15]

Quote:
Originally Posted by gwmss15 View Post
Create an at grade BTS line from the new BTS line at wong wein yai to mahachai city via the existing SRT line. ie this line becomes BTS route not SRT. All the old mahachai SRT line stuff get transferred to maeklong line with new passing loops to create a every 30 min service down there.

"NO Way! SRT would NOTY allow ANYBOEDY else to play aroudn on theri land unless they get a fair share of revenue sharing!"


I had been told by SRT people at maeklong station 2 years ago that the maeklong and mahachai lines are only a contract to SRT ie the land and track is owned and paid for by the city councils of maeklong and mahachai not by SRT as SRT only gets paid a monthly fee to operate the trains and stations on theses lines. They noted that this arrangement occurred when the lines converted from steam hauled to DMUs in the 1960's.

Thus SRT would only lose the operation contract so in theory BTS could take over the operation and upgrades of these lines. To be honest the city of mahachai and maeklong should sack SRT for doing a poor job of running a quality rail service. they put there oldest trains on these line on purpose and the level of maintenance is very low on the trains, stations and tracks. plus they have never attempted to extend or upgrade the maeklong and mahachai lines train service in anyway.

Thus BTS should take it over and bring it upto 21st century standards not 19th century standards.

[Wisarut]

Quote:
Originally Posted by gwmss15 View Post
Create an at grade BTS line from the new BTS line at wong wein yai to mahachai city via the existing SRT line. ie this line becomes BTS route not SRT. All the old mahachai SRT line stuff get transferred to maeklong line with new passing loops to create a every 30 min service down there.

"NO Way! SRT would NOTY allow ANYBOEDY else to play aroudn on theri land unless they get a fair share of revenue sharing!"


I had been told by SRT people at maeklong station 2 years ago that the maeklong and mahachai lines are only a contract to SRT ie the land and track is owned and paid for by the city councils of maeklong and mahachai not by SRT as SRT only gets paid a monthly fee to operate the trains and stations on theses lines. They noted that this arrangement occurred when the lines converted from steam hauled to DMUs in the 1960's.

Thus SRT would only lose the operation contract so in theory BTS could take over the operation and upgrades of these lines. To be honest the city of mahachai and maeklong should sack SRT for doing a poor job of running a quality rail service. they put there oldest trains on these line on purpose and the level of maintenance is very low on the trains, stations and tracks. plus they have never attempted to extend or upgrade the maeklong and mahachai lines train service in anyway.

Thus BTS should take it over and bring it upto 21st century standards not 19th century standards.

The problem is that many of thsoe SRT Union have perrrenial Distrust Private Sectors ... They still equate the Pivate enterprise's participation on SRT traffic operations as the 19th century things while they think that their thought is more modern things ... whcih they would NEVER want to return to the day of 40-year or 50-year concession in the 19th century ....

[Yappofloyd]

Quote:
Originally Posted by gwmss15 View Post
Create an at grade BTS line from the new BTS line at wong wein yai to mahachai city via the existing SRT line. ie this line becomes BTS route not SRT. All the old mahachai SRT line stuff get transferred to maeklong line with new passing loops to create a every 30 min service down there.

"NO Way! SRT would NOTY allow ANYBOEDY else to play aroudn on theri land unless they get a fair share of revenue sharing!"


I had been told by SRT people at maeklong station 2 years ago that the maeklong and mahachai lines are only a contract to SRT ie the land and track is owned and paid for by the city councils of maeklong and mahachai not by SRT as SRT only gets paid a monthly fee to operate the trains and stations on theses lines. They noted that this arrangement occurred when the lines converted from steam hauled to DMUs in the 1960's.

Thus SRT would only lose the operation contract so in theory BTS could take over the operation and upgrades of these lines. To be honest the city of mahachai and maeklong should sack SRT for doing a poor job of running a quality rail service. they put there oldest trains on these line on purpose and the level of maintenance is very low on the trains, stations and tracks. plus they have never attempted to extend or upgrade the maeklong and mahachai lines train service in anyway.

Thus BTS should take it over and bring it upto 21st century standards not 19th century standards.
We're a bit off the Yellow/Brown/Pink topic of the thread but your info on the SRT leases in mahachai and Maeklong is very interesting.

I do like the Rangsit to Mahachai Red Line proposal by the SRT but only if it is not narrow guage. Rama II is a growth corridor so a metro to Mahachai makes sense.

But as I and others have said before, if the SRT had vision they could make this corridor the new corridor to the far south hooking up at Petchburi which would mean the metro lines plus long distance lines. Once you get half way to Mahachai the right of way opens up so there is the space there and it would free up the inner north lines before Bang Sue.

[Wisarut]

BTW, SRT land strip for Mahachai lien & mae Klogn line is 14 meter wide, much naroower than the regular area of the main lines whcih are specified to 40 meter wide ....

[gwmss15]

14 meters should be just enough for a double track line. each line would take up4 meters leaving about 3 meters each side for station platform and substations etc you put the ticket office over the tracks so you have to walk down to the platform so i don't see any land issues as a problem if it is really 14 meters wide. Although around wong wein yai its seems to be only 4 meters wide. ie just enough room for the single track and train.

anyway sorry this is a bit off topic is it possiable to have this split out to a new topics thanks MODs.

[Wisarut]

Khun Napolean has posted the Link for Yellow LRT, Pink and Brown LRT here
Yellow Line with 5 options
http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/9864/1r2yellbigea8.jpg

Pink Line
http://img229.imageshack.us/img229/3592/r2pinkbm3.jpg


Brown Line
[igm]http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/4500/r3blw1.jpg[/img]

REF: http://www.fs-yellow-brown-pink.com/

[The Enforcer!]

Sorry if this seems stupid but why is the Brown Line not just part of the Orange Line? After all without the Orange Line is serves no real purpose.

The Enforcer!

[Yappofloyd]

Thanks to nazery in Skyscrapercity for posting this article which I am taking the liberty to post here. I don't like mono-rails for medium to long line mass transit. Any attempt with the cross town Yellow and Pink lines would be foolish in the long run as mono-rail could not cope with future pax numbers.

Scomi's monorail going places By Marina Emmanuel Published: 2008/10/03 BusinessTimes

http://www.btimes.com.my/Current_News/BTIMES/Saturday/Frontpage/skolmi.xml/Article/Current_News/BTIMES/Images/btgraph10/scomi.jpg

Scomi Engineering is believed to be in talks with a party in Bahrain to submit a proposal to the government there as well as readying a proposal for two monorail lines in BangkokSCOMI Engineering Bhd is set to submit proposals to the authorities in Bahrain and Thailand next year for urban monorail systems.

Sources said the company is using its network as an oil and gas player in the Middle East, Southeast and South Asia, and it has been doing the groundwork for monorail systems in some of these cities for over a year."The company expects to be busy with monorail systems in these markets over the next five years," a source told Business Times.

Scomi Engineering is believed to be in talks with a party in Bahrain to submit a proposal to the government there.This week, the Bahrain government announced an overhauling of the country's public transportation through the introduction of a monorail metro system.Media reports in the Middle East stated that the Bahrain government had ordered a feasibility study to revamp the transportation system to ease congestion on its roads and pre-empt mounting traffic.Besides Bahrain, Scomi is also eyeing Dubai in the United Arab Emirates and Qatar as potential monorail markets. It plans to use the Middle East as a launchpad to enter North Africa.

The source also said that the Thai government had visited many cities across the globe, including Kuala Lumpur, to study monorail systems. "The Thai authorities are looking at ways to complement the country's rail-way projects with monorail systems to cut cost, noise and construction time," he said.

Monorails, he noted, can be completed in two to three years and halve the construction cost compared with that for elevated railways. It also reduces noise pollution because of its rubber wheels."Scomi is currently preparing to make a study and this will be followed up with a proposal for two monorail lines in Bangkok," the source added.

It was reported that Thailand's Office of Transport and Traffic Policy and Planning had announced that two railway projects, the 12km Lat Phrao-Bang Kapi-Hua Mak Yellow Line and the 10km Tiwanont-Chaeng Watthana-Bang Sue Pink Line, would be converted from ordinary railways to monorails, which are reported to be more suited for construction along narrow routes.

[Wisarut]

Scomi's monorail going places By Marina Emmanuel Published: 2008/10/03 BusinessTimes

It was reported that Thailand's Office of Transport and Traffic Policy and Planning had announced that two railway projects, the 12km Lat Phrao-Bang Kapi-Hua Mak Yellow Line and the 10km Tiwanont-Chaeng Watthana-Bang Sue Pink Line (Read: Lak SI Station), would be converted from ordinary railways to monorails, which are reported to be more suited for construction along narrow routes.

IMHO. It seem to me that If they are going to stretch the line from Tiwanon all the way to Minburi, people would ask for either LRT or Skytrain since Monorail would not be able to cope with that kind of traffic ...

Furthemore, It seems to me that PPP would not like to offense those who run Van vervice from paklkret to Minburi and pakkret to Ram Khamhaeng via Lad Phrao who are the main voters for PPP.

PPP seems to know that even they award Phaholyothin extension of BTS to MRTA, BMA which is run by Democrat is gogin to fight back at all cost... so PPP better cut the monorail line to Laksi and Hua Mark as a feeder for Red Line Commuter network ... otherwise the monorails that connecte with BTS would become feeders for BTS which run by Democrat instead of PPP if PPP lost in the BMA Governor Election.

[Wisarut]

Now, the map of the Yellow-Pink-Brown Monrai line can be seen as follows:

1. Yellow Line: It is devided into 2 sections

1.1. Light Yellow: 12.6 km starting at Lad Phrao Subway station and goign alogn Lad Phrao route unti it reached Bang Kapi. After that, it turns right to follow Sri Nakharin road all the way to Hua Mark Railway Station of Airport Link
http://img377.imageshack.us/img377/4079/mapwebpage2sq8.jpg

1.2. Dark Yellow: 17.8 km Starting at Hua Mark railway station and follow Sri Nakharin road all the way to Sri Thepha intersection fbefore turning right to Thepharak road and end up at Swamrong Station of BTS.
http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/6114/mapwebpage3gb1.jpg

2. Brown Line 11km. Starting at Ban Mah canal and followig Sukhaphiban 3 all the way to Suwinthawongse intersection (Minburi) - connecting with pink line at Suwinthawongse

http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/7362/mapwebpage4lm3.jpg

3. Pink line 34.5 km from Khae Rai to Suwinthawongse via Tiwanone, Chaeng Watthana, and Ram Indra
http://img377.imageshack.us/img377/2234/mapwebpage5bx1.jpg

[Wisarut]

After Public Hearing on 16 October 2008 at IMPACT, No objection on these 3 mass transit routes. The only serious comment is the exact positions of the stations alogn with the area to be exappropirated.

However, those who live along Lad Phrao Road have made a clear voice that they deserve Undergroud Heavy Rail like those who live along Ratchadaphisek Ring ... Not that Darn dingy Monorail!

[Wisarut]

Now, Somchai is askign OTP and MRTA tio upgrade the Pink Monorail into Pink MRT since it passed his house.

Furthermroe, SOmchai is askign OTP to transform the Mochit - Saphanmai line into the separated line - no logner a part of BTS extension by adding the route from Phjaholyothin station to Phrannok by building the rotue alogn with Vinbhavadee Rangsit Highway all the way to Dindaeng before goign to Makkasan station of SRT and the n turngin right to go to Yommaraj and the go undergroudn from Yommaraj to Sanam Luang via Larn Luiang road and Ratchadamnoen Avenue. After that the lien wioll go across Chap Hraya to Phran Nok with a stop at Thonburi Station.

[Yappofloyd]

^That explains the the badly titled article in the Post yesterday and poor reporting regarding Dark Green Line changes - no context given in this article - occuring just before the much delayed tender should be going out.

Why is it that every time some pollie has some stupid idea it has to derail years and years of delayed plans? Designs have been completed and ow many times has the Saphan Mai ext been approved? Now a new study is commissioned to change the routing?!?

TRANSPORT New rail links are on track AMORNRAT MAHITTHIROOK Bkk Post 24/10/08
Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat has agreed with a plan to build another two electric rail routes and said it must be done quickly to help ease the traffic congestion in Bangkok and to support the new civil service complex on Chaeng Watthana road. Soithip Traisut, the director-general of the Office of Transport and Traffic Policy and Planning, said Mr Somchai wanted the two electric rail projects - the Pink Line and the Green Line - to be started as early as next year. The issue was discussed at a meeting at the Transport Ministry, chaired by the prime minister.


The Pink Line will be an elevated system covering 35 kilometres, with 22 stations. It will start from Khae Rai and pass through Pak Kret, where the civil service complex is located on Chaeng Wattana road, go through Lak Si, along Rarm Intra road and end at Min Buri. Investment costs are estimated at about 75 billion baht. The line will be extended to Suvarnabhumi airport in the future.


The Green Line will be 17 kilometres long and have 18 stations. It will consist of an eight-kilometre elevated section and a nine-kilometre subway system. It will start at Phahon Yothin road at Central Lat Phrao and run along Vibhavadi Rangsit road then go to Makkasan, Ratchaprasong, Phetchaburi road, Lan Luang road and Ratchadamnoen road.

There will be a tunnel under the Chao Phraya river linking the line to Siriraj Hospital and Phran Nok in Thon Buri. Construction costs are estimated to be about 65 billion baht. Mrs Soithip said her office had commissioned a study of the project, which is expected to be finalised early next year. The Pink Line will serve more than 20,000 officials at the new government complex, which is due to open next year.

[Wisarut]

^That explains the the badly titled article in the Post yesterday and poor reporting regarding Dark Green Line changes - no context given in this article - occuring just before the much delayed tender should be going out.

Why is it that every time some pollie has some stupid idea it has to derail years and years of delayed plans? Designs have been completed and ow many times has the Saphan Mai ext been approved? Now a new study is commissioned to change the routing?!?


That's due to the fact that PPP government could not force BMA and BTSC to sell the stocks of BTS to MRTA. Therofe they have to STEAL the Saphan Mai exctension and implement as trhe separated line before BMA and BTSC implementing Saphan Mai extension as well as Phrannok extension. ... They have to fight throguh this down and dirty trick at all cost ... even they to commit both Stealign and Murzerign to get all done accordign to their term.