Culture crusaders need a history lesson

[Wisarut]

Culture crusaders need a history lesson
The Nation - June 9, 2007

A few days back, while browsing through a Thai-language newspaper, I was startled to read a sensationalist report on teenage pregnancy: "According to a world survey, Thailand ranks fifth in the world", it read.


Of course, this was complete baloney, but it seemed the article was headed straight in one direction - how Western culture was to blame for it all. How wrong they are. In Thailand's historical past, it was completely normal to start a family in your teens and as for those modern notions about finishing college before enjoying sex and making babies - they sound like imported ones to me.


The Culture Ministry and Thai-language mass media outlets repeatedly conclude that the decadence of Thai youth is due to their lack of Thai culture and their embracing that of the West. The Thai press may make a mockery of randy males trying to sow their oats with girls they meet on the Internet, but they forget that having an assortment of lovely girls at one's disposal was once part of everyday life. Historically, a collection of minor wives was viewed as a sign of hierarchy and status. Such practices were not shunned by Thai society and it was even perfectly normal for a wife, on behalf of her husband, to go and find a high calibre minor wife in the local village.


The Culture Ministry commonly has to say this about Thai culture: "It shows the dignity, honour and pride of the Thai people. It is for stability in Thailand, philosophy, discipline, customs, traditions, values and the essence of being Thai."


Okay, let's look into a bit about discipline and customs and read for ourselves about two of Thailand's greatest literary and cultural influences, the epic poem "Khun Chang Khun Phaen", specifically the legendary goings-on of one of its lead characters, Khun Phaen. Instead of pursuing females of a more sensible age, Khun Phaen preferred them young - his first nocturnal encounter being with his darling Miss Phim when she was just 15 years old. Later in the story, Khun Phaen has a string of different ladies, turning into a complete womaniser. Well, his ways surely must be a part of Thai culture as his adventures have been compulsory reading in Thai schools for years.


Next up we have another cultural star whose works are also compulsory reading in Thai schools. He is of course Thailand's most revered poet Sunthorn Phu. What kind of Thai values did he promote? Well he was one very colourful character indeed. It is said that he had an affair with a married woman while still a teenager, turned into an alcoholic and was imprisoned for violent behaviour.


But, what about his writing? Well, let me quote Phu's advice on Thai customs as they relate to being a true Thai woman: "If your husband should rise up in anger, you should quench his wrath, do not raise your voice and answer back." And what about this one: "Every night you should crouch at your husband's feet and pay homage."


Traditionally, as per dictates such as the above, Thai women had very little power, so, why are they now free to go to university and pick their own husbands? Of course, such women's liberation is a shockingly glaring example of Western cultural intrusion. Following Thailand's cultural guidelines, a husband ought to have the right to punch his wife if she forgets to wash his socks. Shouldn't he?


Then there is the issue of dress. The Culture Ministry hires half a dozen staff members to browse through magazines and point out all the awfully indecent pictures of sexy girls posing in revealing spaghetti tops. On the other hand, just pick up an old Thai history book and you may see some interesting illustrations of Thai women waltzing around topless with their breasts out in full view. To claim that any Thai woman who exposes her cleavage to the gaze of others is devoid of "Thainess" is a load of rubbish. The idea of women covering up and wearing a bra was a fairly recent import from the West.


Much of this transition to Western clothing was encouraged by none other than ultra-nationalist dictator Plaek Pibulsongkram. During his heyday of revising Thai ways, not only did he implement a set of cultural mandates that included standing for the anthem twice a day and eating with a fork and spoon, but he also ordered a crackdown on what he saw as uncivilised, pauper-like attire. Schoolgirls had to look presentable, so out with those ugly sarongs and in with the more eye-pleasing skirt. Businessmen had to look smart too, which meant tossing out the longyis and sandals in favour of a shirt, tie and jacket.


The fear of Western influence however continues to this day and often finds its way into economics. Every now and then, we hear high-ranking officials telling us that the rights of all foreigners in the country must be limited to stave off a foreign takeover. However, if you look back on the country's past, foreigners have been influencing Thailand in this way for hundreds of years. Take the noble Bunnag family of the nineteenth century. They have gone down positively as one of the most powerful and influential families in Thai history.


Were they Phuket natives?


I'm afraid they were not; they came from Persia. A leader in another field, the man considered the "father of modern Thai art", Silpa Bhirasri, was an Italian. In fact, you could fill this whole newspaper with stories of how foreigners have had a positive influence on Thai society.


I would like to suggest, therefore, that the Culture Ministry and Thai media stop promoting xenophobia, come to grips with reality and realise that Thai culture isn't as perfect as they wish it was. To deny any fault in favour of blaming Western influence for every trace of decadence in Thai society not only comes off as being naive about historical facts, but also sounds like one lame excuse.

Stephen Cleary


The Nation


SUPHAN BURI

[Wisarut]

Anti-Western bias, male supremacy instilled by Thai education system
Re: "Cultural crusaders need a history lesson", Opinion, June 9.
Lettes to Editor - The Nation - June 10, 2007

I would like to thank Stephen Cleary for his article - it was long overdue. I study at a university in Thailand and my Thai-language lessons are comprised of passages that can only be described as moral conditioning or brainwashing. The passages are extremely patriarchal and full of anti-Western sentiments. It is no wonder such sentiment is on the rise when it is being taught at learning institutions across the country. I could not contain my anger when I was told that women should dress modestly and cover their bodies because males are excited by the sight of a woman's flesh and, if anything should happen to the female, it is her fault. I asked the teacher if he thought males should take some responsibility and perhaps try to control their desires; he did not agree.


I pointed out that it is hot in Thailand and it is unfair that males can wear singlets and remove their shirts without judgement, but a female cannot wear a singlet or shorts above the knee without being judged. I adhere to the conservative dress code in Thailand simply because I do not wish to offend anyone or perpetuate the negative stereotype of "promiscuous" Western women. However, when I return home, I will never again take for granted my freedom to choose the clothes that I wear.


Rebecca


Khon Kaen

[Wisarut]

Now, Both Madame Rebecca and Mr Stephen should tell this to those Thai columnists within the good Thai press klike The Nation Bangkok Post and Matichon who keep CONDEMNING Thai Youths (Generation Y) as Rootless People ... or even Parasites

Thre reason why I suggest both of them to convince those clumnist fist is that those older generation would listen to NO ONE but thsoe who share the same viewpoints.

[Wisarut]

Any Farang sdhould get this viewpoints from this Thai columnist regardign to the cultural bankrupcy and moral decay of the youths.

OPINION / SOCIAL ILLS

Youth sex and cultural bankruptcy
Government officials are partly to blame for premature sexual relations among Thailand's young

By BOONRAK BOONYAKETMALA
Bangkokpost- June 14, 2007

While military and government leaders try to identify the confusing and conflicting formulas to make peace with die-hard supporters of Thaksin Shinawatra and his cronies, somewhere in our spiritually empty cities a number of the relatively youthful Thais are busy undressing each another to prepare themselves for premature sexual relations.

Although these experiences have proven to be heart-breaking for millions of our youth and their parents, nobody in high authority seems to know what to do to curb these activities.

The authorities talk about young people in vain, typically scratching the itch without healing the wound.


For example, the highlight of a recent seminar of some 500 specialists at Government House on this very subject was a proposal to create a Commission for Safe and Creative Media within the umbrella of the Prime Minister's Office.


No report was made available to the public as to what should be done with our policemen _ many of whom have served as a kind of catalyst of premature sexual conduct by being consistently unable to catch the pirates who have copied imported pornographic materials and put it up for sale at very low prices since time immemorial.


These materials were originally available on clunky videotapes, and currently on VCDs and DVDs. Notwithstanding a possible accusation that the above statements may be rather familiar in the world of exaggerated Thai journalism, where poking fun at adventurous sexual relations of our youths in headlines has become an irresponsible fad, countless studies have indeed demonstrated that a large number of Thai youth have admitted to having intercourse with their peers. Many have lived with their partners during their school years, ranging from high school to junior college, without the knowledge of their parents.


Worse still, another goodly number have revealed that they had more than one partner, with the consent of their regular one. Such ''open adultery'' is even given a cute name ''gig'' _ a slang term said to mean something like a spare lover who is less entitled to claim affection than the primary lover. No teen practitioners, however. have specified how many spare lovers can be legitimately entertained.


These adventures have been confirmed by youngsters who have appeared on live television programmes discussing, passionately, their many sexual encounters.


Faced with this new reality, their parents, whose ideals of courtship, romance, love, and sex are inevitably derived from a much simpler era, cannot help feeling heart-broken. However, they do not seem capable of doing much to change their children's behaviour for fear that their little ones will run away with their equally young ''lovers''.


Although the cause of premature sexual relations among the youth may be universally grounded in biological logic, in the Thai case, many ''specialists'' believe that such conduct is largely triggered by a consumption of pornographic materials pirated from abroad. This material is widely available in well-known markets, and from direct-sale sites on the Internet, at relatively low prices.


On the same day that concerned authorities from the ministries of culture, education, and social development and human security were holding the seminar at Government House linking improper teenage sex to pornography, without much talk of the role of police, one of our best-known national crime busters caught some pirates in Nakhon Ratchasima with about 30,000 VCDs and DVDs, many of them pornographic.


Meanwhile, the rest of the retail and wholesale distributors are routinely busy doing a brisk trade at their usual locations, where porn enthusiasts from many countries seek out their services, long known to be user-friendly _ heavenly, in fact, in terms of price and variety. For these foreign visitors, it would be accurate to call Bangkok the Capital of Stolen Pleasure.


During the first week of May 2007, the Abac Poll conducted a survey entitled ''Opinions on Pornographic Media: A Case Study of People Aged 15 to 60 in Bangkok''. It found that 72.4% of respondents saw porn through videotapes or VCDs; 76.5% saw it on the Internet; 47.5% were familiar with such media when they were 15-17 years old; 33.8% confessed it made them want to experiment with sex; 92% believed such materials contributed to premature sex; and more than 87.6% said pornographic material promoted sexual harassment.

[Wisarut]

(Youth sex and cultural bankruptcy Section 2)

If anything, the findings confirm once again that sex starts rather too soon with the help of imported pornography. While it is still unclear how such adventurous behaviour correlates with the repeated conclusions by many comparative world surveys that indicate average Thais do not rank very high in love-making activities, both in terms of quality and quantity, one possible implication is that starting early does not seem to help much in increasing their sexual enjoyment in later life.


Doubtlessly, the seemingly rather promiscuous sexual behaviour of our teenage population, said to be about 20 million people, can be more damaging than can be detected by the naked eye. It is obvious that Thailand is quickly becoming a country of broken hearts.


When our youth is into sex at too young an age, they naturally act as if they are a version of Romeo and Juliet, but often only for days or possibly a few months at most.


Without proper cultural rearing, inadequate education, self-earned money or even a job aspiration, these youngsters have no other place to go but to join the army of the romantically disappointed. In this sense, the female seems more fragile because a significant part of her social learning has taught her to surrender her precious virginity only to the ''right man'' _ a misguided ideological construct that has undoubtedly crushed many innocent hearts and minds.


In reality, the male counterparts, though equally vulnerable in theory, might be in a much better position to get over their heartaches because they appear to be socially pressured to play the role of conqueror.


Though an intriguing question, nobody knows whether or not this divergent destiny of females and males is an explanation for the continuing popularity of Mae Nak Pra Kha-nhong, a folk tale about a female ghost who remains with her husband after her death. It has been repeatedly made into movies to comfort women and scare the men.


Likewise, is it too far-fetched to contend that the tremendous popularity of Korean male singers such as Rain _ whose gentle gestures and naive smiles are opposite to their much more macho Thai counterparts _ among Thai female teenagers is a reflection of their inner, spiritual search for a purer breed of user-friendly boys and men?


In any event, while Rain might not be available to all female youngsters here, by the time they are qualified for their half-baked university degrees in their early twenties, they could well have been heart-broken quite a few times. These seemingly outrageous claims can be attested to by the kinds of songs most popular among our teenagers, which are sadly reflective of a bygone infatuation and incapable of moving forward to measure up to the moment.


Notwithstanding the fact that the pornographic VCDs and DVDs could in no way be so widely available in the country without the tacit approval of our good policemen, who occasionally voice their sincere wish to suppress the small retailers who sell porn, but claim they have inadequate manpower, a lack of evidence and ''the thieves are brainy'' as reasons for the continuing availability of such wares. Nobody seems to care enough to nail the problem where it hurts the most.


It is an open secret even among the pirate operators themselves that such talk is a big lie, because day in and day out they price the extra cost charged by authorities into their products.


For instance, while serving as prime minister for some five years, Thaksin Shinawatra did not do much in this area, except for occasional cosmetic clean-ups. Later, while in exile in London, he concurred that it is not possible to solve any real problems in Thailand because corruption is a component tightly knitted into our social system.


If one is to buy into such a total condemnation by Thaksin, one is practically crippled.


There is no other choice but to learn to tolerate the corruption of our youth by imported pornography made widely available, without resistance, by the deliberate neglect of concerned authorities.


If not, we have no alternative but to tackle the problem at the root cause by doing our utmost to expend much more time and understanding to care for the young so that they may not need to look for misguided attention and pseudo-love elsewhere.


The often-heard claim that parents do not have that kind of time to spare is utterly irresponsible. After all, the context of cultural bankruptcy in which our youths are forced to live their lives has been nothing but a product of a failure of the community of adults to create better conditions for their physical and spiritual growth.


Naturally, another solution is to overtake the future at the political level by seriously furthering your support for proven corruption busters _ in the press, politics, government bureaucracies and non-government organisations _ in their efforts to widen and deepen their role to keep everyone safer from the progressively toxic environment sponsored by our alleged protectors.


Boonrak Boonyaketmala of Thammasat University has published extensively on media, culture, and politics in Thailand and elsewhere.

[jpatokal]

While military and government leaders try to identify the confusing and conflicting formulas to make peace with die-hard supporters of Thaksin Shinawatra and his cronies, somewhere in our spiritually empty cities a number of the relatively youthful Thais are busy undressing each another to prepare themselves for premature sexual relations. Although these experiences have proven to be heart-breaking for millions of our youth and their parents, nobody in high authority seems to know what to do to curb these activities.
Well, I think those videos ncr posted a while about how to open a bra with one hand are a good starting point for making premature sexual relations less heart-breaking :p

Meanwhile, the rest of the retail and wholesale distributors are routinely busy doing a brisk trade at their usual locations, where porn enthusiasts from many countries seek out their services, long known to be user-friendly _ heavenly, in fact, in terms of price and variety. For these foreign visitors, it would be accurate to call Bangkok the Capital of Stolen Pleasure.
Farangs don't come to Bangkok to buy illegal porn, they come for the real thing...

[ncr]

Well, I think those videos ncr posted a while about how to open a bra with one hand are a good starting point for making premature sexual relations less heart-breaking :pYou don't want to accuse me of corrupting Thai youths by posting immoral advice, do you? :p

No report was made available to the public as to what should be done with our policemen _ many of whom have served as a kind of catalyst of premature sexual conduct by being consistently unable to catch the pirates who have copied imported pornographic materials and put it up for sale at very low prices since time immemorial.Of course they are all imported. No pornographic video has ever been filmed in Thailand, or with Thai actors.... Thais don't engage in such smutty activities! (It's against their "culture".) :rolleyes:

[Wisarut]

Well, Just to remind you about Nong Natt Controversies as well as all otehr Thai models in Porno business ....

[ncr]

Yes, my comment was meant ironically.

[BangkokPundit]

imported[/B]. No pornographic video has ever been filmed in Thailand, or with Thai actors.... Thais don't engage in such smutty activities! (It's against their "culture".) :rolleyes:

Funnily enough, I would say the local variety is much more popular, particularly those "hidden"/amateur clip types or photographs. They are of course not always sold and are mostly forwarded by e-mail/uploaded online and are a local creation although I imagine some "nominee" foreign company will take the blame.

[ncr]

Well, I think those videos ncr posted a while about how to open a bra with one hand are a good starting point for making premature sexual relations less heart-breaking :pBy the way, here (http://www.angkor.com/2bangkok/2bangkok/forum/showthread.php?t=2401)'s that thread again, if you missed it...... (and no, it wasn't actually about bras!)

[Wisarut]

Keep Criticising without making any constructive opinions will ALWAYS ruin everything.
http://www.bangkokbiznews.com/2007/05/28/WW12_1211_news.php?newsid=73941

[Stephen Cleary]

Firstly, thanks for posting my article here.

And a thanks again to Bangkok Pundit for a couple of quotes, i borrowed from his site.

Yeah, the Thais never make porno movies (of others) They do instead prefer the home-grown variety and post them on the Internet for free.

Favourites have included the infamous 'Hi-So' videos a few years back involving a well-known charming man and his 'randy lover'.

BTW: Does anyone know the outcome of this story? The girl supposedly fled the country and her mum was gonna sue....was it the guy's mother?

Next up, we have lovely Nong Anna, a former singing superstar. Her bedroom video was definetly better than any Hi-So ones, what with a pair of handcuffs and nice background music to liven the debauchery up.

Again, does anyone know what eventually happened to her?

Anyway, i posted a follow-up article/blog to the one published at The Nation - it's over on my steve suphan blogsite if you want to check it out.


Stephen Cleary

[Wisarut]

Yah ... I also have seen that Anna's Movie in addition to the Nortorious Nong Natt ... and Nong Natt has already set an exampole how to make a good Thai AV Stars to mach with Japanese AV Stars :p

[Wisarut]

ROtten Thai Teens: They will be either Grandparents at 28 Yerar-old or becoem Juvenile Delequence - or even Teen Dacoits - by imitating Japanese - Korean Teens who are sex addicts and have NO moreal at all! :eek:

http://www.manager.co.th/QOL/ViewNews.aspx?NewsID=9500000099459
http://matichon.co.th/khaosod/khaosod_detail.php?s_tag=03p0129240850&day=2007-08-24&sectionid=0301
http://www.matichon.co.th/matichon/matichon_detail.php?s_tag=01p0117240850&day=2007-08-24&sectionid=0101

[Wisarut]

Oh for the case of Nong Natt, she is very lucky ... comparing to the case of Noon Nueng (Nattha) who has taken a X-rate photograph (been taken photographs whoe having a sex outdoor) in Poed Borisut Gravue Magazine ...to get money for tuition fee ....

This scandal had forced the rector to kick her out of the university ... and she was so upset that she committed SUICIDE .... :eek:

[Wisarut]

Now, His Majesty has made a speech abotu Thainess to Thai diplomats ... as a response to ROOTLESS Thai Youth as well as thsoe who have inferior complex ... who forget how to speak Thai just after beign abroad for a FEW days
http://www.manager.co.th/QOL/ViewNews.aspx?NewsID=9500000102088

Khunying Khaisee has resaponse ot His Majesty's Speech of Thainess
http://www.manager.co.th/QOL/ViewNews.aspx?NewsID=9500000102177

[Wisarut]

overdrive:Revisiting the classics to improve Thai today


by Thanong Khanthong
The Nation
Published on August 31, 2007

Speaking the other day to a group of consul-generals and senior Thai diplomats at the Dusidalai Throne Hall, His Majesty the King expressed concern that some Thais who live or study abroad fail to speak Thai properly after they return home.


The Thai language is a national heritage that every Thai is obliged to preserve because it shows Thailand has been a civilised country longer than most other countries, even some in Europe, the King pointed out.


"You diplomats might feel sad that the Thai people who live abroad for a few days or for a short time can't speak Thai once they return home. Because they think that when they go abroad they have to learn how not to become Thai. I have sympathy for you in this case because you are diplomats. Those who go abroad for a few days, when they meet the ambassadors, they can't speak Thai. But the foreigners who meet you can speak Thai although they stayed in Thailand for only a short time. This sounds very strange," the King said. "But we have to understand that those who might never have thought of travelling abroad but have a chance to go abroad might feel that they have an inferiority complex. But most Thais do not have any inferiority complex. They are proud to be Thai because living in Thailand, becoming a Thai, they can learn that Thailand and the Thai people are good."


Since the King spent most of his youth studying in Switzerland, he had to catch up when learning how to read and write Thai. The King admitted that even when he was 18, he could not read or write Thai well. Fortunately, the Princess Mother always spoke to him in Thai. Later on he studied the Thai language until he mastered it.


If you read the King's books "Nai In Phu Pid Thong Lang Phra", "Tito" and "Phra Maha Chanaka", you recognise immediately that he is a master of Thai prose. He writes in short, succinct and very clear sentences, with comma and full stop markings. You may also call him a supreme prose stylist.


The King's message is that he would like the Thai people to be proud of their heritage and their civilisation. In fact, the Thai language was invented more than 700 years ago during the reign of King Ramkhamhaeng of the Sukhothai period. It had a system of its own. Indeed, 700 years ago America had not been discovered by Europeans. King Ramkhamhaeng's reign coincided with the Middle Ages in Europe, during which time that continent was regarded as still being somewhat backward.


"You diplomats must brainwash [those who forget the Thai language] that Thailand has had its own language for a long time. We have had our own culture for longer than several countries in Europe.


"Europe then was still in the 'Dark Ages', which means that civilisation had not yet been fully realised. Thailand was already a civilised country during the Middle Ages of Europe. We also have to tell those who think that Thailand is not a civilised country to have a better understanding that Thailand was already civilised and had its own language during the Middle Ages, while most others did not have their own languages," the King said.


In the late 1980s I visited MR Kukrit Pramoj at his beautiful Thai-style house in Soi Suan Plu. I asked him how he developed his exceptional skill in the Thai language. He told me that as a child in a big family, he was always asked to read for his mother and the other phuyai. He read out loud "Khun Chang Khun Phaen " and other Thai literary classics. "I was reading like a parrot, without knowing the real meaning. But gradually I absorbed these works," he said.


Before Mom Kukrit wrote his novels, he went back to read the old classics, to set his own temperament. He told me that he would have "Sam Kok " or "Romance of the Three Kingdoms" (Chao Phya Phraklang's edition) and "Rajathiraj" ("The King of All Kings") by his bed all the time. He would read passages from these two books in his head and try to absorb their styles, their expressions, their rhythms and their idioms. So when he sat down to write his novels, he got the "feel" or the flow of the language from these two classics.


Most people would say that his "Si Phaen Din " ("The Four Reigns") represents the crown jewel of Thai prose. But Kukrit told me that "Phama Sia Muang " ("The Burmese Lost Their Country") was his best. "Just read carefully and you'll feel that it has all the language of Rajathiraj," he told me.


Among contemporary Thais, I like to listen to MR Thanatsri Svastivat's way of speaking Thai. He has the Thai outlook and all the idioms in his Thai usage. I also used to have conversations with Chirayu Issarangun Na Ayutthaya, the director of the Crown Property Bureau. His manner and his way of expressing the Thai language was also very unique.


I feel ashamed that my Thai is very bad. I really need to go back to the classics and other old Thai writings to brush up my Thai - in thinking, style and substance.

// -------------------------------------
I have a copy of "Phama Sia Muang " ("The Burmese Lost Their Country") in my hand ... and I could testify that it is REALLY good .... This book also added the a satirical comments of Thai SOciety in 1968 - 1969 ... unde the Siamese Smile Prime Minister (Field Marshall Thanam Kittikhajorn) - before he became a dictator.

[doseiai]

I think what most of us often forget is that this is human nature. Old people everywhere, not just in Thailand, tend to think in terms of "right and wrong" and young tend to want freedom to build their identities.

Its called Erickon's Psychosocial Stages of Development, developed over 100 years ago.
Everybody goes thru all stages, but the stages are the "defining" ones in each age group.
I only learned it myself cuz i had to take medical related classes...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychosocial_development#Later Adulthood (60 years-Death)

(If someone could find the thai wikipedia page, that would rock!)

What it basically says is, the best qualities of old people is their Integrity, but their worst quality is Condemnation. Most of this is brought on by reflection on life as they are getting "ready to die", and that they want to "pass the torch" as moral people.

With young, they need LIFE EXPERIENCE to build their character, to learn what is wrong, to build their identities.

What the old fail to realize is, the process of life itself will make the young people they are criticizing into OVERLY CONSERVATIVE people just like them...and that they were considered REBELLIOUS when they were young as well.

One Malaysian ad (Malaysia Truly Asia...im sure u've seen them) a few years back on TV really struck a chord...it said "Life is a hard teacher, so I try not to be". I really would like to follow this advice.

Often the old do the exact opposite, they try to be the hard teacher, so life is easy. But, life is NEVER EASY, we just trade one set of problems for another. If we dont have problems, we will invent them...its human nature!

Old people try to "speed up" the process out of FEAR, or try to have u "avoid" bad things, as old people have a long life with many things they regret. But that never works, the process speed isn't changeable, and the old can't control the unpredictability of life any more than the young.

When old simply make decisions, they don't teach the young "how to make good decisions". Real teaching involves telling a story, and letting the listener make their own decisions, conclusions, etc. Old people have valuable lessons to tell, but the WAY they tell them turns young off, and doesn't teach a thing.

I hope this helps us to understand WHY old people are the way they are. Of course, dealing with their stupidities is another matter entirely...

So i guess the best thing to say these old farts is:

"I know you have valuable life experience that makes you worried about me, that you would like to share. I would like to know, but please don't make my decisions for me. Teach me so I can make good decisions on my own".

Then listen to just the story, understanding it, but ignoring the message and conclusions...because conclusions are different for each person, situation, time, etc.

I only wish Farang weren't a scapegoat!