Specifications & Design Details

[ncr]

We have read many figures about the subway and also details about the station designs, sizes, depths etc.

But one fact is still missing, as far as I know:

I was wondering what are the distances between the stations, especially the shortest and the longest one between two stations?

[ncr]

Is there any information on when they will introduce the remaining 9 station symbols?

So far, only the stations from Hualamphong to Rama IX have their own distinctive logos (as seen at http://www.angkor.com/2bangkok/2bangkok/Subway/subwaysymbols.shtml).

The others, I noticed, have coloured bands running along the top of the walls in the platform areas (I saw blue, yellow, orange, red) - is this the same colour code that Wisarut wrote about in the abovementioned article?

1) Blue is for interchange
2) Red is for commercial areas
3) Green for parks
4) Orange for areas of moderate density
5) Yellow for the Royal family
6) Cyan (or azure) is for waterways

[Wisarut]

Khun NCR,

The average distance is about 800-1000m. The longest distance would DEFINITELY be from Kamphaeng Phet to Bangsue and the shortest one would be Samyan to Silom or so.

[ncr]

So this question has been answered on the main page today:

No further symbols for the rest of the stations - July 9, 2004

2Bangkok.com contacted MRTA to ask about the lack of subways symbols north of the Thai Cultural Station. Their Public Relations department said it was because from Hua Lamphong to Thai Cultural Center there were "special or important places" to base the symbols on, but there are "no special or important places from Huay Kwang to Bang Sue."

We asked if the reason really was that two different contractors worked on the line and the one that worked on the northern section did not participate in the symbol project. MRTA's reply: "something like that."

We finally asked if there were any plans to create further symbols for the rest of the stations. The answer: "No. Construction is finished."

It is not surprising no further emphasis is being put on the symbols. The existing symbols were poorly received and are not being used at all in signage or maps.

[ncr]

I found that no, there's no colour scheme (according to location) for the 9 stations without station symbols.

Instead, each of them apparently has its own colour:

Thai Cultural Centre - Blue
Huay Khwang - Orange
Sutthisan - Red
Ratchadaphisek - Pink
Lat Phrao - Light Blue/Turquoise
Phahonyothin - Yellow

(Didn't get any further to check Chatuchak, Kamphaeng Phet and Bangsue today.....)

[Wisarut]

Khn NCR,

Blue Stripe for Chatuchak Park station -> Due to the Interchange Station

red Stripe for Kamphaengphet station due to the weekend market and or Tor Kor

Blue Stripe for Bangsue due to the Interchange with both Northern and Southern Train at Bangsue

[ncr]

Khun Wisarut,

Hmmmm..... so colour code for the last three stations again? Doesn't make sense.

And what does Tor Kor stand for?

[ncr]

On several occasions I took the times between stations with my watch (from the moment when doors closed until they opened again).

Here they are (in minutes and seconds):

Bangsue - Kamphaeng Phet......................1:24 [1:33]
Kamphaeng Phet - Chatuchak....................1:13 [1:21]
Chatuchak - Phahonyothin.........................2:11 [2:23]
Phahonyothin - Lat Phrao..........................1:38 [1:40]
Lat Phrao - Ratchadaphisek.......................1:37 [1:41]
Ratchadaphisek - Sutthisan........................1:24 [1:29]
Sutthisan - Huay Khwang...........................1:35 [1:42]
Huay Khwang - Thai Cultural Center..........1:49 [1:43]
Thai Cultural Center - Phra Ram 9..............1:28 [1:30]
Phra Ram 9 - Phetchaburi...........................1:28 [1:22]
Phetchaburi - Sukhumvit.............................1:37 [1:36]
Sukhumvit - Queen Sirikit Center................2:00 [2:00]
Queen Sirikit Center - Khlong Toei..............1:34 [1:36]
Khlong Toei - Lumphini................................1:21 [1:21]
Lumphini - Silom..........................................1:2 0 [1:23]
Silom - Sam Yan..........................................1:13 [1:16]
Sam Yan - Hualamphong.............................1:43 [2:02]
TOTAL............................................. .......... 26:35

Square brackets []: times taken on a different occasion

Of course this is not an exact representation of the distances between stations as the speed may not be constant, e.g. sometimes there are sharp curves in between stations (Bangsue-Kamphaeng Phet, K.P.-Chatuchak, Chatuchak-Phahonyothin, Lat Phrao-Ratchadaphisek, Queen Sirikit Center-Khlong Toei) where the train has to slow down. But it gives quite a good impression nevertheless.

One and a half minutes seems to be the average value (1:34, to be exact). The Rama IV stretch of the route has the shortest distances between stations. Kamphaeng Phet - Chatuchak could be even shorter than Silom - Sam Yan, considering the former includes a curve, the speed thus being lower.

So Khun Wisarut, Bangsue - Kamphaeng Phet is definitely not the longest one!

Anyway, this shows that for longer journeys, you can roughly estimate 2 minutes per station traveled (incl. time when train is stopped - usually only 20 seconds), which would add up to 34 minutes for the whole trip.

That again, at a total length of 20 km, makes an average speed of 35 km/h (including stops), as stated in the subway specs (and 45 km/h for the time the train is actually in motion).

[jpatokal]

Originally posted by ncr
And what does Tor Kor stand for?
I presume the Or Tor Kor flower market, right across the street from Chatuchak market.

[admin]

Or Tor Kor is a high-so market across from Chatuchak Market--almost every time you visit you will see a celebrity shopping--the market itself looks like any other Thai market, but the quality (and price) of the items displayed is much higher...

[admin]

A reader writes: "I have just returned from an extensive trip through Thailand and was amazed. Thailand is a beautiful country with a deep respect for its own cultural heritage, a joy to travel in. Here in the US I represent a small group of people who are trying to get our local governments to implement mass transit in our own city. A question has been raised concerning the width of the standard subway rail- is it the same 3.2 meters found on the railroads in Thailand? What is the diameter of the subway cars? These questions would provide much needed information, thanks for your help!"

[Wisarut]

The following is Skytrain technical data I obtain from
Trainweb as well as Subway technical data from Siemens (Thailand): (tons here is metric tons 1 metric ton = 2240 Lb)

Skytrain Subway
Motorized Car - overall length 21.8 m 21.8 m
Motorized Car - body length 21.28 m 21.28 m
Bogey Car - overall length 21.5 m 21.5 m
Bogey Car - body length 20.76 m 20.76 m
coupled bodies distance 0.74 m 0.74 m
overall length 65.100 m 65.100 m
Width overall 3.12 m 3.120 m
Track Gauge 1.4351 m 1.4351 m
Wheel arrangement Bo’Bo’+2’2’+Bo’Bo’ Bo’Bo’+2’2’+Bo’Bo’
Passenger seats 126 Seat 126 Seat
capacity (crush load) 1100 passengers 886 passengers
@ 8 persons/m2 @ 6 persons/m2
(For high density (for lesser density
of Sukhumvit, Silom of Rama 4 and
and Phaholyothin) Ratchadaphisek)
Max. axle load 14 tons 15.4 tons
Steel Rail Size UIC54 UIC54
Max. tare weight 105.6 tons 107 tons
Wheel diameter 850 mm new, 850 mm new
775 mm worn 775 mm worn
Acceleration (max.) 1.25 m/s2 0.9 m/s2
Deceleration
(service brake) 1.34 m/s2 0.9 m/s2
Service Speed 35 km/hr 35 km/hr
Max Speed 80 km/hr 80 km/hr
Sensors 10000 sensors 60000 sensors
Voice rocorder No Yes


Yoiu better contact with Siemens (Thailand) for this technical issues since Siemens has produced both Skytrain adn Subway rollign stocks.

[ncr]

In a final step and in order to finish this approach, now that we have the average speed, we can of course calculate (hypothetical, approximate) distances between stations (i.e. from center to center). This assumes that the speed is constant (which, in reality, it isn't).

Bangsue - Kamphaeng Phet.......................1053 m
Kamphaeng Phet - Chatuchak......................915 m
Chatuchak - Phahonyothin.........................1643 m
Phahonyothin - Lat Phrao...........................1229 m
Lat Phrao - Ratchadaphisek........................1216 m
Ratchadaphisek - Sutthisan........................1053 m
Sutthisan - Huay Khwang...........................1191 m
Huay Khwang - Thai Cultural Center...........1377 m
Thai Cultural Center - Phra Ram 9..............1103 m
Phra Ram 9 - Phetchaburi...........................1103 m
Phetchaburi - Sukhumvit.............................1216 m
Sukhumvit - Queen Sirikit Center................1505 m
Queen Sirikit Center - Khlong Toei..............1179 m
Khlong Toei - Lumphini................................1016 m
Lumphini - Silom..........................................100 3 m
Silom - Sam Yan.............................................91 5 m
Sam Yan - Hualamphong.............................1292 m
TOTAL............................................. ..........20,009 m

Average = 1177 m

When we factor in the average station length of 224 m (according to the stats published on 2bangkok.com), that makes 953 m between station ends, which corresponds to what Khun Wisarut said above.

[Ganyc]

Halo, Bangkok,

Below are the official subway route network names of the stations from MRTA, released to your Thailand tourism board office in Orchard Road, Singapore, and I got a copy from the office yesterday:

Bang Sue - Kamphaengphet - Chatuchak Park - Phahon Yotin - Lat Phrao - Ratchadaphisek - Sutthisan - Huai Khwang - Thailand Cultural Centre - Phra Ram 9 - Phetchaburi - Sukhumvit - Queen Sirikit National Convention Centre - Khlong Toei - Lumphini - Si Lom - Sam Yan - Hua Lamphong.

My questions: How many times have MRTA changed the names of these stations ? Why aren't there fixed spellings to these Thai names in English ? I feel they should remain as they are now and not change further. From this episode, I can conclude that Thailand has developed its own variant of English, called Thai English, ie. I call it Thailish, in short, just like Singapore has Singapore English, or Singlish.

[Wisarut]

Khun Gyanc,

The main problem you mentioned is ACTUALLY the Romanization problem since many of Thai people HATE the
official romanization scheme imoposed by Royal Institute (www.royin.go.th) ...

Therefore, they just come up with romanizxatioon scheme to fit their tastes! That it!

[The Enforcer!]

To me it is both sad and annoying that the Thai government (or appropriate body) cannot agree one way of translating!!

For Example ....

Driving under the Tollway to the airport the airport is spelt Don Muang and Don Mueang on alternate signs!

And in Suan Phlu (Immigration Office) the road name is spelt six different ways ... Suan Phlu, Suna Phlu, Suan Plu, Suan Pru, Suna Pu and Suan Pu!!

The Enforcer!

[ncr]

We had a similar thread before, remember?

http://www.angkor.com/2bangkok/2bangkok/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=214

Don't worry too much if it's Hua Lamphong or Hualamphong, the place remains the same. (Admitted, this one is not a complicated/serious case.) I guess we simply have to live with Thai transliteration inconsistencies....;)

[Hitesh]

Ganyc to answer your original question, a few of the stations had thair names changed about 18 months ago, long before the subway opened to the public. They weren't spelling changes though, just name changes to bettwe reflect the area of the station.
For example, Bon Kai station was changed to Klong Toei. The reason being, more people knew where Klong Toei was, and the station wasn't actually in Bon Kai. There were 2 or 3 other name changes, im sure Khun Wisarut knows the situation better than I do.

[ncr]

Originally posted by Hitesh

For example, Bon Kai station was changed to Klong Toei. The reason being, more people knew where Klong Toei was, and the station wasn't actually in Bon Kai. There were 2 or 3 other name changes, im sure Khun Wisarut knows the situation better than I do. .... yes, and all that was already discussed here:

http://www.angkor.com/2bangkok/2bangkok/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=244

[The Enforcer!]

Originally posted by Hitesh
For example, Bon Kai station was changed to Klong Toei. The reason being, more people knew where Klong Toei was, and the station wasn't actually in Bon Kai.

Unfortunately it is is not actually in Klong Toei either!!

The Enforcer!

[The Enforcer!]

Originally posted by ncr
We had a similar thread before, remember?

http://www.angkor.com/2bangkok/2bangkok/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=214

Don't worry too much if it's Hua Lamphong or Hualamphong, the place remains the same. (Admitted, this one is not a complicated/serious case.) I guess we simply have to live with Thai transliteration inconsistencies....;)

Dear Khun NCR,

Yes it has been said before but I think that is part of the fact that it is important. Thailand relies on Tourism for 40% of its foreign exchange. Despite what the French think, the most common language amongst non-Chinese Tourists is English.

I just feel that it is not beyond some authority to establish a uniform translation for Thai into English. After all, you and I know what it says in Thai (so the English really does not matter) but to the average tourist it lowers their opinion of the country as (yet again) they spout "oh look, they can't even spell Surawong properly!".

The Enforcer!

[ncr]

Acknowledged, Mr. Enforcer. :D

(I don't like all these crazy spelling variations, either.)

[The Enforcer!]

Sorry if I was sounding off - bad day!

The Enforcer!

[jpatokal]

OK, somebody explain this one to me:

3) No commercial development is allowed to prevent terrorist attacks. The stations would not be as deep as the initial phase of the Blue Line (not more than three underground floors) to cut costs and for safety. [No commercial development means less clutter in the stations, fewer people hanging around, and better security. Previous commercial deals in the subway were penned before 9/11.]
There's just one simple way to get rid of terrorism: get rid of the reasons why people want to blow each other up. It's completely impossible to protect a public transit system from terrorism and there isn't really much reason to even try.

Then again, BTS has in their infinite wisdom removed all garbage cans from the 3rd floor platforms (where they are surrounded by air and would go "poof" harmless), but kept them on the 1st floor near the entrances where you have maximum crowding and the chance of bringing down the whole thing. :rolleyes:

[The Enforcer!]

Originally posted by jpatokal
Then again, BTS has in their infinite wisdom removed all garbage cans from the 3rd floor platforms (where they are surrounded by air and would go "poof" harmless), but kept them on the 1st floor near the entrances where you have maximum crowding and the chance of bringing down the whole thing. :rolleyes:

Believe me they do not go "Poof" when in open air.

I was 50m from an IRA bomb in Oxford Street London back in 1992. Luckily it was placed under the metal liner of the litter bin and the litter bin was concrete.

The explosion was deafening, the metal liner shot up into the air some 30/40m, and the bits of concrete shot all over the place. Fortunately only four people were injured (as in needed hospital treatment). I was just 'blown' off my feet and landed on my back!

The Enforcer!

[jpatokal]

No, in the amazing world of explosives that is "going poof". An explosion occurs when chemical rapidly forms gas and heat, increasing the local pressure. If contained, the pressure can build up high and the resulting blast is strong... but if (say) placed in a plastic bag on a Skytrain station platform, the gases dissipate rapidly and you'll have little more than a fireball.

Note that in the case you describe, the container was concrete and metal, which allows a substantial amount of pressure to build.

[chabaa]

Hello,

I found detailed construction infos of the subway, e.g. the procedure of how to dig out a station or subway parallel to a flyover http://www.thaiengineering.com/column/project/MRTA/state.asp
It is all in thai and the infos are partly more understandable for civil engineers, but they also added a lot of fotos while construction
http://www.thaiengineering.com/column/project/MRTA/mrta31_10_45/mrta31_10_45.asp
which indeed look more to help internal communication about fixing of unsolved problems while process of construction.
Main page is here: http://www.thaiengineering.com/column/project/MRTA/

Greetings,
chabaa