Next PM?

[GWR]

Is there anyone in Thai Ruk Thai or any other party who could do as good a job as Thaksin, or better? I can't think of a single name. As the only Thai politician I have ever seen weep, I doubt Aphisit could ever survive as PM.

[Tettyan]

As the only Thai politician I have ever seen weep, I doubt Aphisit could ever survive as PM.

You forgot Sanan. The tears of the crocodile helped win his son that by-election in Phijit last October.

In all seriousness, I think there are many capable leaders out there, it's just that Thaksin's hogging the spotlight all the time makes us forget about them. Chaturon Chaiseng certainly comes to mind, as does Deputy PM Wissanu Krea-Ngam, but the fact he didn't run in the last election disqualifies him. In my ideal world, I wish Supachai Panitchpakdi could just parachute into the PM's seat from UNCTAD. But in the meantime, I don't find Abhisit to be a bad second choice.

And what do you mean by "as good a job as Thaksin"?

[dingo]

interesting observation about "mr. limelight". not exactly
the qualities of a true leader.

i have read many debates and stories about the so-called
effectiveness of mr. thaksin, the following from the wall
street journal summed it up concisely as anyone (and only
from the economic business perspective which is supposed
to be Thaksins redeeming qualities):

-----

The Wall Street Journal
Selling Thailand
January 25, 2006

The largest corporate acquisition in Thailand's history was announced on Monday. With a dearth of foreign direct investment and lagging growth rates, we're all for animal spirits in the Land of Smiles. But Temasek's $1.87 billion purchase of a controlling stake in Shin Corp. doesn't presage a newly competitive, freer economic landscape.

The deal itself was a complex maneuver. Through a web of holding companies, Singapore's government-controlled investment company, Temasek Holdings, purchased 49.6% of Shin Corp. Perhaps this sale will put conflict of interest rumors about Mr. Thaksin's influence over Shin Corp. to rest. That would be a good thing, because frankly, the Prime Minister has bigger things to worry about.

Sandwiched between two emerging giants with starkly different economic growth models, India and China, Thailand is struggling to find its way. "Thaksinomics" was always a hodge-podge mix of big-ticket government spending on infrastructure projects and various giveaways. It's done little to provide jobs and boost domestic growth.

Consider the numbers. The year after Mr. Thaksin took office in 2002, the Thai economy was growing at around 5% annually, not very impressive for a developing country in a burgeoning region. After a brief uptick, it's expected to grow around the same rate in 2006. The country is still heavily dependent on exports, which contribute about 50% of total GDP, and foreign direct investment in the country is sagging.

The picture has worsened of late. Sure, some events, like high oil prices and droughts, are out of government's control. But most aren't. Privatization plans have stalled. Almost none of Mr. Thaksin's infrastructure projects have materialized. What's more, Thailand's proposed free trade agreement with the U.S. is in limbo for now, an indication that Bangkok isn't as keen as it once was on breaking down trade barriers.

Mr. Thaksin, in his characteristically acerbic fashion, expressed frustration with questions about the Shin Corp. sale: "Do you think it's easy to find anyone with more than 70 billion baht in cash?" he asked, as reported by Agence France Presse. If you pried open the Thai economy more to allow a more competitive free market to develop, it wouldn't be so difficult, Mr. Prime Minister.

-----

dingo

[2 Cents]

Is there anyone in Thai Ruk Thai or any other party who could do as good a job as Thaksin, or better? I can't think of a single name. As the only Thai politician I have ever seen weep, I doubt Aphisit could ever survive as PM.
Uhmmm.....my question is slightly different, I was wondered who can be worse (in term of running the country) than Taksin. Can you give me reasons on why you think Abhisit can do more harm to Thailand than Taksin? Or you are saying that he could not survive because of all the unclassy attack on his personality? :confused:

You forgot Sanan. The tears of the crocodile helped win his son that by-election in Phijit last October.

In all seriousness, I think there are many capable leaders out there, it's just that Thaksin's hogging the spotlight all the time makes us forget about them. Chaturon Chaiseng certainly comes to mind, as does Deputy PM Wissanu Krea-Ngam, but the fact he didn't run in the last election disqualifies him. In my ideal world, I wish Supachai Panitchpakdi could just parachute into the PM's seat from UNCTAD. But in the meantime, I don't find Abhisit to be a bad second choice.

I sure love to see Supachai come to the rescue, and of course, I sure believe that someone who has Ph.D. in Economics from Oxford would do a better job than a Ph.D. in Criminal Justice from Sam....Sam...Sam what univ?
Opppsss, am I being too subjective here :(

[Scuba22]

The Wall St Journal has it exactly right - the domestic programs haven't helped and the Shin sale was a public relations disaster. But they don't ask why it's turned out this way. There are three possibilities:

1. Thaksin's own stories - the domestic programs ARE successful (or will be given more time), there was nothing wrong with the Shin sale (ie complicated holding structures and offshore transactions were NOT done simply to squeeze ethically dubious activities through legal loopholes); he's just a good guy who's climbed up from humble origins to become very rich by using his sharp business and problem-solving know-how, but a bunch of malcontents and jealous whiners keep trying to make him look bad with no justification.

2. Thaksin is a liar and a fraud - far from the stories he tells about himself, he comes from a very prestigious and affluent family, married the daughter of a very senior police general, used this connection to make a fortune selling the police computer equipment, systematically traded up the military-controlled government-concession ladder to get wealthy, entered politics when the miliitary role in politics shrank after 1992, and then conspired with other wealth government concessionaires (urban & rural) to take power by dangling promises of fabulous riches over people while they quietly helped themselves to even bigger state prizes like PTT and EGAT by subverting every independent watchdog agency and passing self-serving legislation without fanfare.

3. Something else I can't think of

To believe the first scenario, one needs to be either stupid, crazy, or a co-conspirator; kind of like the 35% of Americans that still approve of Bush.

If you beleive the second scenario, then ANYONE would be a better PM. The biggest lunatic has taken over the asylum and we're wondering who might be better? My barber would be better. The roast pork guy downstairs would be better. A tic-tac-toe playing chicken would be better.

But not for long. Eventually Thailand needs to find a real leader - someone who cares more about the country than himself. Thaksin certainly ain't it.

Wissanu? Is he a good guy? He seems to be defending his boss all the time.

Cheers,

Scuba22

[GWR]

But not for long. Eventually Thailand needs to find a real leader - someone who cares more about the country than himself. Thaksin certainly ain't it.
Scuba22
What ever happens, let's hope we don't get another Superman impersonator.

Which is precisely the way Sonthi and Chumlong seem to be shaping up. Give me a break from all that Sonthi 'yellow' neckerchief bullshit or Chamlong's constant desire to storm the barricades to impress his old army academy chums. Then there's Sanan and Barnharn looking all sparkly-eyed because the media have temporarily stopped treating them like has beens.

[Tettyan]

Wissanu? Is he a good guy? He seems to be defending his boss all the time.


I'm not a fan of what Wissanu has done over the last 4 years, but before then, he was well respected on all sides. A leader of the student movement in the 1970s, he went on to get a SJD from Berkeley's law school and became a law professor at Chula. He became head of the Cabinet's legal department in 1993 and served in that position under every government until Thaksin "promoted" him to Deputy PM in 2002. GWR's original question was about who's capable for the PM's job - I don't have to like Wissanu, but I can't argue that he's not competant. And as you say, frankly, anyone else is better than Thaksin at this point. :)

Another name I'd like to throw out there is Public Health Minister Phinij Jarusombat. He was also a student leader in the 1970s, and holds some clout over the party (unlike Chaturon and Wissanu) as head of the Isan-based Wang Phayanak faction.

Cheers,

Tettyan

[The Enforcer!]

Chaturon Chaisang


The Enforcer!

[dingo]

2. Thaksin is a liar and a fraud - far from the stories he tells about himself, he comes from a very prestigious and affluent family, married the daughter of a very senior police general, used this connection to make a fortune selling the police computer equipment, systematically traded up the military-controlled government-concession ladder to get wealthy, entered politics when the miliitary role in politics shrank after 1992, and then conspired with other wealth government concessionaires (urban & rural) to take power by dangling promises of fabulous riches over people while they quietly helped themselves to even bigger state prizes like PTT and EGAT by subverting every independent watchdog agency and passing self-serving legislation without fanfare.

If you beleive the second scenario, then ANYONE would be a better PM. The biggest lunatic has taken over the asylum and we're wondering who might be better? My barber would be better. The roast pork guy downstairs would be better. A tic-tac-toe playing chicken would be better.

Scuba22

I always have a hard time understanding what the basis is for
the claims that Thaksin is a talented leader and businessman.
It is not clear to me that Thaksin would be even a big fish in
a any pond if it weren't for the failings of the financial, legal,
judicial, media, etc. institutions here in Thailand. And it is not
clear that whatever positives could be attributed to his
administration, are justified by the social as well as economic
costs.

One might conclude is that it is Thailand that made Thaksin. Until
there is some effort to address these larger issues, even if Thaksin
goes now, it is only a matter of time before another one comes
along (kind of like a bad wart). These are some of the same
reasons why it is hard to identify potential leaders, as was pointed
out earlier, noone else is allowed the spotlight (within and outside
of the administration) except Thaksin.

If there were stable institutions in place, your barbeque pork guy
could be better than Thaksin - it is only speculation at this
point. Even if the next leader came from within the TRT, the
changes could be significant. Maybe that is the type of compromise
the opposition parties need to push forward, especially to deflect
these issues of "power grabbing" (if indeed, the accusations are
not true).

--dingo

[GWR]

Maybe we should amend that to who has the capability and the necessary financial clout. The names mentioned so far don't seem to have the necessary dosh to bewitch the public.

[Tettyan]

GWR,

At this point, I don't think the people want another multi-billionaire in the job, at least for the time being. I think the public and TRT has had enough of abrasive tycoons for now. It's best if whoever takes over from now is as little like Thaksin as possible. That's why I have tried to suggest names that are relatively non-controversial both among the public and within TRT iteslf.

[Wisarut]

When I look at businessman who advocate for political stability in the same way as mainland CHina and Vietnam by asking Premier Thaksin to stay as Prime Minister, That business man has been BURNT by the word from Political activist in Khun Sorayut's Night Talks that:

"Not amouth you advocate for political stability by keeping Thaksin in the same of place, we will REMOVE that Thaksin OUT Now! He has NO moral to set the example for the youth to follows. He invoves too mcuh conflicts of interest? Are the businesspersons like YOU that IMMORAL as him ... Definitely, you ARE such immoral bunch!"

[Scuba22]

Dingo - welcome to the conversation! I'm totally with you on the "Thaksin the great businessman" myth. In fact, there's a protracted debate in another thread ("Thaksin - businessman & capitalist?") about this. After that debate, I had to change my position - at first I thought he was just a very good policy manipulator and government welfare recipient; I now think he also got very lucky by stumbling onto a industry (telecoms) that was on the verge of taking off. Some people seem to think that this wasn't luck at all, rather a very shrewd reading of the future. I'm not convinced at all - just look at his other brainfarts: Thai Elite Card, Liverpool FC, Fashion Hub, Smart ID card, etc. etc.

I also agree that Thaksin is a symptom, not the real disease; which I also agree is the pathetic state of Thai political institutions. If you look at Thai history from 1933, you see this continuous cycle of increasing corruption/authoritarianism followed by upheaval and chaos leading to a big change and then a return to the increasing corruption/authoritarianism. It seems that whatever insitutions are conceived, the crooks show up to subvert it while no one else pays attention until the situation gets completely unbearable. What's happening now could have been entirely predicted by how the original asset concealment scandal played out. Did anyone really believe that Thaksin transferred his assets to his maid and driver by "mistake"?

I think the entire idea that a single leader will fix the situation misses the point entirely, but I do think that many Thai people expect and want this magical Superman to show up. HM has spoken often about "self-sufficiency", yet I wonder if people hear him. The very veneration of the monarchy is contradictory to HM's message. I worry that so long as people really believe in the Superman, they won't take responsibility for themselves and self-sufficiency will continue to be elusive.

Personally, I'm skeptical of being able to "impose" personal responsibility from the top down. I think that real reform needs to happen from the bottom up, yet a big part of Thailand's past problems had to do with local fiefdoms and bosses stifling true decentralized self-government. Thaksin made noises about this, but what was really done? I've been in discussions with several provincial government officials - PAOs, TAOs, governors, etc. - but everyone pretty much looks to the center for guidance, or is too timid to try their own ideas.

Sorry for the ramble - I had meant to ask this question: do you think that TRT as a party will survive without Thaksin? My feeling is that most of the real reformers in the party, the people who really believed in grassroots development, free markets, etc. are pretty much gone, leaving mostly people who use those ideals to get votes so they can do whatever they want. TRT was built as a Thaksin bandwagon - if he's gone, why would people stay? There is a limit to how much government bank funds they can dole out - and it's not like there are a lot of other ideas .

What are the chances that any of these "prominent social critics" or academics would enter the government?

Cheers,
Scuba22

[dingo]

Sorry for the ramble - I had meant to ask this question: do you think that TRT as a party will survive without Thaksin? My feeling is that most of the real reformers in the party, the people who really believed in grassroots development, free markets, etc. are pretty much gone, leaving mostly people who use those ideals to get votes so they can do whatever they want. TRT was built as a Thaksin bandwagon - if he's gone, why would people stay? There is a limit to how much government bank funds they can dole out - and it's not like there are a lot of other ideas .

What are the chances that any of these "prominent social critics" or academics would enter the government?

Cheers,
Scuba22


there is a theme here of homing in the institutions in Thailand
as a major issue that we seem to be agreeing on. i think most
people under-rate the importance of these things to prevent
a thaksin or (name your favorite despot) "deja-vu" experience.

one thing thaksin did figure out is the importance of the rural
vote. unfortunately, he also figured out the ease of which it
can be bought. at this point, i am not sure TRT needs
someone to bankroll things upfront anymore as it does control
the provinces with more than just vote buying. being able to
allocate funding to the provinces doesn't hurt.

unfortunately, i am not familar with the other social activists
as some of you are. even without thaksin though, my gut feel
is the TRT is the party in the catbird seat right now. it would
take some serious infighting within the party to relinquish that
position (something that seems not to be unheard of in thai
politics).

regards,

--dingo

ps: i will check the other thread out later.

[GWR]

Was TRT ever a real party? Me thinks it is little more than Glee Club based around a founder with a domineering personality and loadsa dosh. With Thaksin out of the equation, it could disintegrate in a heartbeat.

[ooddy]

The other issue to ponder is: what if you were Thaksin, what would you do to rectify the situation?

I don't think it's too late to find a common ground with opposition parties. May be a coalition party effort should be looked into to embrace all party in order to stabilize the situation. He should try to share power and blame to members of other political parties and see how thing will shake up...

[dingo]

Was TRT ever a real party? Me thinks it is little more than Glee Club based around a founder with a domineering personality and loadsa dosh. With Thaksin out of the equation, it could disintegrate in a heartbeat.

i agree with the glee club analogy. but now i think the TRT has the
ability to be a bit self-perpetuating. the money to kick-start an
evil clone is really necessary right now as all the ducks are lined-up
so to speak. the bulk of the TRT largese (sp?) seems to be coming
from the government, through the TRT hands, to the people.

i dont think this is what Reagan promoted as trickle-down economics,
but maybe it is a kinda type of trickle-down corruption.

--dingo

[GWR]

ML Nattakorn is renowned for his use of taxpayer's money to promote TRT on Channel 11's Newsline. However, with his expensive education and daddy running the Bank of Thailand, he should know a few things. After all, he isn't Mom Luang for nothing. Check out the cold fish eyes:-

http://www.geocities.com/mlnattakorn/Personal/PleumSeriousFormalFaceUpperSuitTieI.jpg


He sees no possibility of Thaksin resigning, but has obviously contemplated the idea that a new TRT PM may be necessary. Here's his list. There may be a few mistakes, as I wasn't taking careful notes:-


1) Suriya: But Natters thinks he is too much of a Thaksin man and too stained by CTX.
2) Sudarat: Again, too much of a Thaksin ...... woman.
3) Somkid Jarusripitak: Natters vaguely indicates that this person has all the right qualifications, but (rather Mohatir-style) there's something WRONG with him.
4) ? Duh! But yet again natters seemed to suggest yuh man had something wrong
5) Pokin Polakul: Who Nattakorn appeared to favor, but felt he didn't have a snowball's chance in hell.

Natters also wonders why Chaturong doesn't have a look in, as he is probably the most suited to the post.

For a man who is desperately keen on most Thaksin things, Khun Nattakorn made it pretty obvious that TRT is far from stable. He is also of the opinion that one of the boycotting parties has set a deliberate trap for Thaksin. I suspect there is some truth in this. However, I find little to get incensed about here. If you deliberately set out to ride roughshod over your critics, you can hardly expect them to play softball with you.

Actually the biggest laugh of the show was yuh ML demanding SET's ......... Na Ranong does something to curb the awful activities of that dreadful ........ Leophairatana person over at TPI and Thai Polenc. Only a ML could get away with such biassed & distorted news commentary.

[Wisarut]

Well Ee Sudarat and Ee Simboh (Photjaman) are too much for us to swallow

Ee Sudarat is too much flirt around while Ee Simboh has become Thai version of Indira Gandhi ... ecven though she has nto assumed PM office yet.

Ai Somsak - that crocodile tear from Sukhothai ... hed to say but he badly wanyth to replace ee Sudarat Hee Men (rotten pussX/Whoirecat Sudarat) for sure.

Ai Bhokhin -> That Damned laweer who are good on law but Moreally BANKRUPTED ... so martally Bankrupt that I would rather seem him Thrown into fryign/red hot steel woks full of steaming oil and lard to cook him alive
Same can be APPlied to that Bastarx Bureaucrat Wissanu.

Even that Gestapo of Chiangrai (Mr. Yongyut Dissayaphairat) has secret police forces, Northerners would rather hire snipers to spray him with AK47 and M16 rifle bullets or even Anti-Tank RPG to obliterate him and his men from the surface of earth ...

Khun Oy (Jaturong) seems tobe the best candidate but his poloicy has already Alienated hte teachers as well as their fellow October Movement to such extend that he has lost any support within and without party ....

[Wisarut]

The leader with Square Face has chosen Ee Waen Hee Men (Sudarat) as the one to repalce him ... even though it might cause House Burnigng at Chan Song lah palace ;) :D

[RAMPAGE]

In times of crisis Thais will always look to HM for guidance. If one is trying to guess a potential candidate for PM in the current state of chaos, then the name of Surayud Chulanont springs to mind as the next "Anand Panyarachun".

[Scuba22]

What does it say about democracy in Thailand when the PM's appointed by HM are consistently far better than the PM's elected by the people?

If people really respected HM, they would think about the how he selects PMs and use similar judgement.

Scuba22

[ncr]

Ai Somsak - that crocodile tear from Sukhothai ... hed to say but he badly wanyth to replace ee Sudarat Hee Men (rotten pussX/Whoirecat Sudarat) for sure.

Ai Bhokhin -> That Damned laweer who are good on law but Moreally BANKRUPTED ... so martally Bankrupt that I would rather seem him Thrown into fryign/red hot steel woks full of steaming oil and lard to cook him alive
Same can be APPlied to that Bastarx Bureaucrat Wissanu.Nothing beats a tasteful political diatribe delivered by Wisarut! :p

Khun Oy (Jaturong) seems tobe the best candidate...At least he's the only TRT member addressed as "Khun", not "Ai", by Wisarut.

[ncr]

Sudarat: Again, too much of a Thaksin ...... woman.I just wondered.... can it even be imagined that a woman becomes Thai Prime Minister in the foreseeable future, or is there too much social/political resistance to that idea?

[mdechgan]

If Sudarat makes all the right moves, it might be possible.

1) The hate is not with the TRT party or MPs but with Thaksin himself. She could distance herself from Thaksin enough. She is still a main figure in the TRT

2) She could sway the remaining TRT supporters upcountry to her favor.

3) She did have a very good run in the Bangkok governor's race against Samak. I think she came in second. She has high Bangkok popularity and is very popular especially in the Yaowarat-Samphantawong-Sampeng (lots of money) area which is her area.

4) She made a good move cancelling Bt200m of farmers debt last week. Very popular with rural people.

But alas, she's a woman. No man wants a cunt to run their country if other choices are available. MP, governor or senator ok, but not the top position. Hillary Clinton would have a hard time in the U.S. trying to be president.

5) Unlike the U.S. this isn't a direct election. If somehow the TRT remains in power after Thaksin resigns, the TRT could possibly choose her as the PM.
Hey, it happened in New Zealand.

Women control alot of things, especially behind the scenes aka Mrs. Thaksin, Mrs. Chavalit, Mrs. Banharn.

[Scuba22]

I don't think Thais would have any problem with a woman PM. There have been a fair number of women PM's around Asia - Megawati in Indonesia, Aquino & Arroyo in the Philippines, Indira Gandhi (and now Sonia Gandhi) in India, even Golda Meir in Israel. Granted, most of them are part of political dynasties with either husbands or dads in politics, but still people don't seem to be so worried about it.

You also see a fair number of women in high positions - Ministers like Sudarat, CEOs like Jada of Siam Commercial Bank, public officials like Dr. Porntip.

If Suradat has a problem it will be because she is Sudarat, not because she's a woman. The 30 B scheme already shows she's an idiot (see the "grass-roots policy" thread for this discussion). Of course, if Thaksin selects her to succeed him, he'll call anyone who opposes her a sexist.

Cheers - Scuba22

[ooddy]

woman is still a second class citizen in Thailand. Men is in charge and in control, although men is playing games allowing women to take the lead once in a while. But, the end result is still men. In social gathering you will find they are not mingled, men and women; they tend to be segregated. And often time, majority of men still control financial aspects of the family. I think a woman has to be highly regarded and in command of respect, almost in a queen-like statute, to gain the authority enough to be PM...

[GWR]

Here's the Nation list from the frontpage, in case it gets moved. I note that this is pretty much the same list that Nattakorn Devakul was working with on Channel 11's Newsline. Som much so that I wonder if he compiled it or copied it. Inevitable that you get such a mismatched mish-mash when you buy anyone who is 'free'. One really wonders what is in the head of a party that places 'married to the mob' Sonthaya Kunplume above Chaturon Chaisang:-

http://203.154.97.18/breaking/read.php?lang=en&newsid=116050

Top 20 Thai Rak Thai party-list candidates

The top 20 candidates on the Thai Rak Thai's party-list are:

1 Thaksin Shinawatra

2 Suriya Jungrungreangkit

3 Sudarat Keyuraphan

4 Somkid Jatusripitak

5 Bhokin Bhalakula

6 Suwat Liptapanlop

7 Pinij Jarusombat

8 Pongthep Thepkanchana

9 Sora-at Klinpratoom

10 Wan Muhamad Noor Matha

11 Yaowapha Wongsawat

12 Thamarak Isarangura

13 Somsak Thepsuthin

14 Sonthaya Kunplume

15 Yongyuth Tiyapairat

16 Somchai Sunthornwat

17 Chaturon Chaisang

18 Adisai Potharamic

19 Promin Lertsuridej

20 Phumtham Vejjayachai

[GWR]

Is there anyone in Thai Ruk Thai or any other party who could do as good a job as Thaksin, or better? I can't think of a single name. As the only Thai politician I have ever seen weep, I doubt Aphisit could ever survive as PM.

Sanan and Sanoh. The eternal powerbrokers. These guys are a bit like aging Chinese senior citizen males. If they don't get to deflower at least one virgin per month, life gets to seem intolerable. It's almost inevitable that Sanoh will get involved with the opposition in some form, as he will never forgive Thaksin for treating him like an impotent old fool. There will be no half-decent opposition until these two silly old buggers kick the bucket. They corrupt everything they touch. Not to mention Barnharn, the Walking ATM or Suthep Theugsaban with his extremely thuglike way of doing things. How can Abhisit possibly control this bunch of rogues?

[Tettyan]

.

Personally, I'm skeptical of being able to "impose" personal responsibility from the top down. I think that real reform needs to happen from the bottom up, yet a big part of Thailand's past problems had to do with local fiefdoms and bosses stifling true decentralized self-government. Thaksin made noises about this, but what was really done? I've been in discussions with several provincial government officials - PAOs, TAOs, governors, etc. - but everyone pretty much looks to the center for guidance, or is too timid to try their own ideas.


Scuba,

This is an issue that I am quite interested in. I'd like hear more about the discussions and experiences you've had. Should I start another thread on the topic? We could also discuss education issues there - I suggesting creating another thread on that back during the teachers' anti-decentralization protest, but only JW (Pundit) seemed interested in discussing.

Let me know what you think. You can reply to this either on the open forum or using the "private message" feature.

Regards,

Tettyan

[Scuba22]

Tettyan - by all means, please start a new thread on decentralization, I'll certainly participate. There's lots I'd like to learn about this issue as well!

Cheers,

Scub22

[ncr]

You also see a fair number of women in high positions - Ministers like Sudarat, CEOs like Jada of Siam Commercial Bank, public officials like Dr. Porntip.Not to forget Khunying Jaruvan.......

[Scuba22]

Yeah, there are plenty of women in pretty high power positions, but I also think ooddy had a point about women being second class citizens. For all the powerful women, there's some pretty nasty business going on with trafficking. And though i realize that not all prostitution is forced, i can't imagine that it's an occupation that many women would want to enter if they felt they had a choice. So it's hard to make a strong case that women have full equality.

Still, the status of women in the Philippines, Indonesia and India is not that different from what I can see (though I'm definitely NOT an expert in womens' issues), and all those countries had female PMs, even though all were related to a previous PM.

I bet if Porntip ran for office, she'd win in a landslide. Or pehaps Jaruvan. But I bet they'd never run, which is probably why they'd win!

Scuba22

[GWR]

It would be nice to think that Thailand would be a better place if there were far more women in high-ranks. And in fairness, women managers are improving things in many sectors. But not in politics! Most Thai women politicians seem to be at least as greedy and incompetent as their male counterparts. So far I haven't seen the likes of Sudaporn Keyuraphan or Kanchana Silapa-Archa daughter do much else other than lick the arse of money.

[2 Cents]

As a woman, I sure love to see more women involve in business of managing the country, but your guys have made a good point.

I don't know much about Khunying Jaruwan, but from what I heard, she seems to be a very clean and impartial person. However, if Thailand were to have woman PM, I saw Sudarat as the most likely candidate (of course not the best candidate). If that's the case, it's just a series of unfortunate events for Thailand.

[Scuba22]

GWR - good point about the quality of ladies in current politics. Obviously simply having women in a situation doesn't guarantee that it gets better, but one hopes that opening opportunities to all people increases the chances of finding someone good.

Cheers,

Scuba22

[Wisarut]

Well, Khunying Jaruwan is very respectul figure diespite of her Protestant belief ... Similar thing can be said to Khunying Pornthip despite of her rare shortcomings ad well as her charateristics ...

That Spectacled Sudarat with ROTTEN Puss should NEVER match both Khun Ying :eek: :cool: ;) :D :rolleyes: :p :)

[GWR]

Well, Khunying Jaruwan is very respectul figure diespite of her Protestant belief ...
Brought up by a Scottish Presbyterian father and an Anglican mother, I find your comments extremely amusing. Although in fairness, I've always known
that I was a bit lacking in the respectabilty stakes.;) I guess it's something to do with my lack of belief.

[Scuba22]

I didn't know that K Jaruvan was Christian. I've been surprised recently at finding out various Thai people i've been working with, in business and in academia, are Christian- as well as running into Chuwit at midnight mass a few years ago.

Has this all been just coincidence for me, or is there a sizable Christian communit y among the Thai elite? And if so, how did this happen?

I did some work with the Karen people - a minority group in "Myanmar" - and their entire leadership was Christian because the most educated Karen were taught by missionaries. But the Christians were the minority, so the Burmese generals started supporting a splinter group of Buddhist Karen in an inter-Karen rebellion against the Christian leadership.

Could a Christian become PM?

Scuba22

[tonyruamjai]

Recently there are many anti-Thaksin protests in Bangkok and other provinces like Ratchaburi(of course not Pattaya and Phuket).
In fact, Thaksin won the PM seat in 2001 election and 2005 election.
However, his politic route really got in free ball.
Thai Rak Thai Party(www.thairakthai.or.th),
His telecommunication business owned by Thaksin's family (Shin Corp.)
(parental company of AIS mobile network) www.shincorp.com,
Liverpool Football Club's stock (Ministry of Commerce),
Privatization for state enterprises like EGAT(Electricity), BAAC(Bank for agricultural business), etc.........
I suppose if Thaksin's Thai Rak Thai Party belongs the strongest power in politic war, how about others?

My new artwork "Thaksin's reception" in PM Office are exclusively avaliable for you.

Work by: Tonie Yip (Graphic artist)
Origin: Hong Kong
Finished in March 2006
If you want to take one, please contact me via e-mail:
tonie357@yahoo.com.hk